German Soft Skinned Vehicles

[Cross]

German Utility Vehicles

The Kfz. and Sd.Kfz. numbers describe the purpose, and usually the type of vehicle, but not the make or model. Some vehicles were made by more than half a dozen different manufacturers.

Kfz.
Kfz. is an abbreviation for Kraftfahrzeug, which means ‘motor vehicle’.
Kfz. numbers were assigned to all wheeled unarmoured vehicles.

Sd.Kfz.
Sd.Kfz. is an abbreviation for Sonder Kraftfahrzeug, which means ‘special motor vehicle’.
Sd.Kfz. numbers were assigned to all full and half-tracked vehicles, and armoured wheeled vehicles.

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Unit 195 Kubelwagen
1. Should be 2WD not 4WD (unless its given 4WD because of its rugged light-weight design)


Unit 156 Kettenkraftrad
1. The speed of 26 is probably too high for a halftrack that went about 70 or 80Kmh.

Speed 80Kmh sources:
http://www.wwiivehicles.com/germany/...-kettenrad.asp
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/kleines...rad-sdkfz2.htm
http://www.miniatures.de/sd-kfz-2-kl...nkraftrad.html

Speed 70Kmh sources:
http://www.tarrif.net/cgi/production...es&vehiclesX=8
http://ww2drawings.jexiste.fr/Files/...2/Sd.Kfz.2.htm
http://www.tanksinworldwar2.com/germ...enkraftrad.php


Unit 454 Kfz 15

Kfz 15...4x4...(carry 106)...(size 2)...class 26 Utility

The Kfz 15 picture is of a Horch 901, which was the most common German 4x4 utility vehicle, with 14,911 built. The available date, size and 4WD are also correct, the only thing off is the speed of 28. It’s possible the Horch 830 could go that fast, but the 830 is a 2WD car. The road speed of the Horch 901 is 95 Kmh.

Recommended changes:
1. Rename to Kfz 15 Horch 901
2. Adjust speed to 95 Kmh
3. The current icon is shared with the British Humber Box. It would be better if the Kfz 15 Horch had its own icon.

Horch 901 sources:
http://en.valka.cz/viewtopic.php/tit...typ-40/t/65360
http://www.autoviva.com/version.php?..._unit=european
http://www.autogallery.org.ru/m/horchg.htm

Picture of Horch 901


Here’s new icons for those interested (I'll post bmps later)



Icon scale
The Kettenkraftrad is the same scale as the infantry: about 3 to 4 inches to the pixel.
The rest of my soft vehicle icons are about 5 inches to the pixel, which is the rough average of existing soft vehicle icons, and bridges the gap between the tanks and the infantry. Tank icons are usually 6 inches to the pixel



Cross

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Cross

Unit 156 Kettenkraftrad
1. The speed of 26 is probably too high for a halftrack that went about 70 or 80Kmh.

WT#&% ?

I'm quite willing to cut newbies to the game some slack for things like that but not "experienced" players. How you can make a claim like that is beyond me


This has been the ground speed formula since DAY 1

Ground Speed equation is: max km/h speed divided by 3 = SPEED in hexes.

You present some sources that claim 80 km and some that claim 70 km top speed. All that proves is even after all these years "experts" disagree

80 divided by 3 = 26.67

70 divided by 3 = 23.33

We give it 26 which means we are rating the top speed at around 78 km/h.

Don

[Cross]

Originally Posted by DRG

I'm quite willing to cut newbies to the game some slack for things like that but not "experienced" players. How you can make a claim like that is beyond me

Don,

But by way of explanation, I looked at about two dozen vehicles and compared their real life speed with SP, and put the results on a spread sheet.

Then I analyzed the data and found that the following SP speed ‘x’ (in red) was the most consistent (third in green):



I had heard that it was a third of Kmh in the past, but I thought I must have been mistaken, or perhaps that was only for tanks.

So many vehicles were under speed I thought ‘a third’ couldn’t be right, and what I found convincing was well known and documented vehicles, like the Jeep and Kuebelwagen, fit with my ‘x’ assessment, not the ‘third of Kmh’.

Jeep: 104Kmh
Current: 24
My X: 25
Third: 35

GPA Amphib Jeep: 104Kmh
Current: 24
My X: 25
Third: 35

Kuebelwagen: 84 Kmh
Current: 21
My X: 21
Third: 28

Schwimmwagen: 84 Kmh
Current: 21
My X: 21
Third: 28

Jeep 105:
http://www.wwiivehicles.com/usa/truc...truck-jeep.asp

Jeep 104:
http://ww2drawings.jexiste.fr/Files/...latgrille).htm

Jeep 104:
http://www.autogallery.org.ru/willysmb.htm

Kuebelwagen 84:
http://ww2drawings.jexiste.fr/Files/...Kubelwagen.htm

Kuebelwagen 84:
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/volkswa...kubelwagen.htm

Kuebelwagen 80:
http://ww2db.com/vehicle_spec.php?q=O359

Kuebelwagen 80:
http://www.autogallery.org.ru/m/kdf82.htm

Schwimmwagen 84:
http://ww2drawings.jexiste.fr/Files/...hwimmwagen.htm

GPA Amphib Jeep: 104Kmh
http://ww2drawings.jexiste.fr/Files/...s/Ford-GPA.htm


Sorry for jumping to conclusions.

Cross

[DRG]

The published speed data differs by source doesn't it ??

And do we every find consistent data from all sources ??

NO we DO NOT.

I've been doing this now for over 13 years and I know whatever data I enter SOMEBODY can find a source SOMEWHERE that differs. And I also know there are players who live to point them out. Rest assured that unless it is a legitimate data entry error all the speed numbers entered into the OOB's came from some source not thin air and that in all cases we have endevoured to be fair and reasonable.

Don

[Cross]

Don,

You are absolutely right about sources. I have tried to provide at least 3 if I see something that doesn’t seem right.

FTR, my goal here was merely to improve the soft vehicles, which understandably haven’t got as much attention as the AFVs, but remain an important part of the game.

If I post anything that you think is irrelevant or unwarranted, I anticipated that you would just disregard it, and ‘cherry pick’ anything you think is worth looking into.

Cross

[Marcello]

My memory is bit fuzzy on this but I recall, probably a long time ago on the old yahoo group, that it was stated that the speed of the softskins was purposely understated, on the rationale that a truck would be more cautious on the battlefield proper than an armored vehicle.

[Cross]

Originally Posted by Marcello

My memory is bit fuzzy on this but I recall, probably a long time ago on the old yahoo group, that it was stated that the speed of the softskins was purposely understated, on the rationale that a truck would be more cautious on the battlefield proper than an armored vehicle.

Back in the Yahoo! days a few different people were working on OOB, so its quite possible some had a different philosophy in assigning speed.

But the game confirms the hex speed as one third of Kmh.

If you move a vehicle across the map and then hover the cursor over the vehicle, it tells you how fast it’s going:

1 hex: 2 Mph
10: 19 Mph
20: 37 Mph
27: 50 Mph (80 Kmh)

So if you move a vehicle along a flat road to it’s maximum distance, the cursor will tell you the top speed for that vehicle in Mph.

Cross

[DRG]

The info on speeds in the game can be found in MOBHack Help

Don