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  #1  
Old May 31st, 2009, 03:25 PM
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Default Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Formations 240-241-242: Rocket Bn, Rocket Bty and Rocket Pl
According to the "The Iraqi Army: Organization and Tactics" the towed MRLs (107mm Type 63 and the likes) were used in special “light batteries” composed by twelve launchers organized in three platoons with four launchers each.
I therefore suggest the following changes
Formation 242 be renamed “Rocket Sec” and have only two units
Formation 241 be renamed “Rocket Pl” and have only four units
Formation 240 be renamed “Rocket Bty” and have twelve MRL. Availability dates for this one would also be changed to 1/1960-4/2003 instead of current 1/1970-12/1981, which does not make sense.
Such organization would also be more useful for gaming purposes in (who’s going to buy the 27 rocket launchers of the current bn anyway?)

A towed and offboard version of the 152mm D-20 should be added, using the already available weapon n. 230 152mm D20 FH..
Unit 426 from and unit 177 from OOB 11 Russia can be used as templates.
Availability dates: 1/1975-4/2003
Many sources and plenty of pictures like the following support its availability in the iraqi inventory.
http://www.militaryfactory.com/armor/imgs/d20.jpg

Unit 97: 180mm S-23 FG
Unit 181: 180mm S23 Pl
Final availability date should be restricted to 12/1988.
If they had them at all, none were probably available by OIF. They aren’t mentioned in many sources in first place and no pictures of it have emerged. The ordnance disposal reports have not turned up any 180mm ammo for them either despite the fact they are very comprehensive. I would guess that at a minimum there were not many of them to start with and they were used up well before 2003.

EDIT
Alternatively Formation 240 could have a 1/1970-4/2003 availability. But it should be available in the Iran-Iraq/GW1/OIF period and not stop at 1981.

Last edited by Marcello; June 2nd, 2009 at 02:13 AM..
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 01:55 AM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Unit 90: 122mm Sddm FH
Unit 175: 122mm Sddm Pl.
They should be deleted
Those “Saddam” guns were just locally assembled D-30. Like a lot of things in Iraq they got the “Saddam” label but they actually were nothing of special.
Currently in the game they have much greater range than the ordinary D-30, 215 vs 205
But the ordnance disposal reports have not turned up any 122mm (unlike others calibers) RAP or base bleed round that would warrant a D-30 clone with extra range.

Formation 31: R Guards Wpn Co
Formation 32: R Guards Wpn Co
Formation 291: Mot Bn Sup't Co

They should be deleted they do not match any known formation or any likely support allotment.

Formation 316: Bde Hy Mor Co
It could be deleted as redundant (others formations alredy cover thee use of the 160mm mortars adequately).
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Old June 9th, 2009, 12:59 AM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Formation 165: Bde AA Company
It should be renamed “Bde SP AA Bn” or similar.Three SP SAM platoon, formation n. 175, should be added slots 6-7-8. Availability dates should be changed to 1/1978-4/2003
This formation would be used to represent the mixed SPAA/SP-SAM battalions used in the armored divisions.

Unit 178: 155mm M114 Pl
Initial availability date should be changed to to 1/1986 or similar. AFAIK the ones in service were captured from Iran. Picture should be changed to n. 12089 representing the towed gun.

Formation 295: Inf Bde Rec Co
Should be renamed Recon Plt + or similar and have a 4/2003 cutoff.

Formation 296: Mech Bde Rec Co
It should be deleted

Formation 298: Arm Bde Rec Co
It should have the formations in the slots 5-6-7 deleted and renamed Recon Plt (AT)
"The Iraqi Army: Organization and Tactics" describes a recon platoon variant composed by two standard BRDMs and four SP-ATGM. 4/2003 cutoff should be applied
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Old June 12th, 2009, 02:02 PM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Some units to be added

1) Unit 983 GSP Ferry from OOB 11 Russia
2) Unit 775 PTS-M from OOB 11 Russia
Availability dates should be late 70’s, say 1/1978-4/2003. There are pictures showing them in iraqi service.

Here for example a GSP ferrying an iraqi T-62 across a river during the Iran Iraq war:



Another abandoned in a tank graveyard in Iraq:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdraide...n/photostream/

PTS-M abandoned in Iraq:



3) Unit 52 Ferret Mk 1 from OOB 7 (Great Britain)
Availability dates 1/1955-12/1970.
It could be armed with weapon n. 29 .50 cal M2 AAMG
Source: SIPRI

4) Unit n.2 Vickers Mk.6b from OOB 64 (Saudi Arabia). Availability dates 1/1946-12/1959
Armament should be the same from unit 280 Humber Mk III.
Source : I found a picture of it and a brief description at http://www.jedsite.info/tanks-victor...ion-intro.html
Though the website is not longer available I have seen pics of it elsewhere. I could track them down if you are interested.
It seems the iraqis refurbished a number of Vickers light tanks abandoned by the british at the end of WW2 and put them in service postwar. At least one of them took part in the 1958 coup and was turned into a monument.

5) An antiaircraft machine gun using weapon n. 29 .50 cal M2 AAMG
Availability date 1/1946-12/1960
This would be used to provide an antiaircraft machine gun before the arrival of the Zpu in 1959. As it is the only towed antiaircraft weapons available before that date are the 40mm Bofors.
It seems common sense that some antiaircraft machine gun was available or could have been (mounting some available .50 cal on some custom made AA mount for example) in that timeframe if needed.
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Old June 16th, 2009, 12:52 PM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Formation 386:R/G SP-ATGM Pl
Formation 297: 3 SP ATGM
Formation 185: SP-ATGM Pl

Should have four units instead of three. As far I can gather from the “The Iraqi Army: Organization and Tactics” four SP-ATGM per platoon were the norm.
Also formation 185 should get a 4/2003 cutoff.


Units 159-160: MiG-29A
They should be deleted.
None would have been really available for tactical ground attack missions, because:
1)MIG-29A was an air to air version with only limited, dumb bombs only, strike capabilities
2)There were few of them at hand and those were earmarked for air defence.
3)There were several others dedicated strike planes available for ground attack.
4)Serviceability was poor, between 1991 and 2003 the MIG-23/25 did most of the air to air work as they were much easier to keep in service for the iraqi logistics. By accounts in 2003 only a couple of MIG-29s were still barely flyable. No way they would have been wasted for tactical strikes.

Source Acig.org.


Formation 141: Bombers
Final availability date of this formation should be restricted to 4/2003
Most of the planes that might qualify as “level bombers” in the game were destroyed or otherwise eliminated during the Gulf War.
1)SU-24s, with only one exception, were destroyed or defected to Iran during the Gulf War.
2)TU-22s were already out of active service during the Gulf War and were all destroyed on the ground by coalition bombing.

Only a single TU-16 was left in flyable condition betweeen the Gulf War and OIF.

Source Acig.org.

Unit 190: PC-7
It should be deleted. It is not suitable as level bomber.
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Old June 24th, 2009, 12:57 PM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Some notes on the border guards

Formation 28: Border Guard Co
I would suggest it being restructured with a scout section (unit 450) in slot 2 and a MG section (formation 215) in slot 5. Final availability date would be 4/2003.

Only formation 48 Border Guard Pl would be left after that date. During the Saddam era border guards were occasionally put together in large units for frontline combat against the kurdish insurrections and the iranians but after 2003 they would be deployed in platoon size strenght only.

Unit 506: Border Guards
Initial availability date should be pushed back to 1/1986

Unit 507-508: Border Guards
They should be either deleted or rearmed, there would not have been BG-15 grenade launchers for them.
One squad should be armed with AK-47/RPK/grenades
Availability date 1/1986-12/2020

Sources:
Iraq's Ground Forces: An Assessment
http://www.foia.cia.gov

Fleet Marine Force Reference Publication (FMFRP) 3-203, Lessons
Learned: The Iran-Iraq War, Vol . I
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Old August 1st, 2009, 12:01 AM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

on the list......

Don
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  #8  
Old August 9th, 2009, 12:40 PM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Unit 68: BMP-2
1) It should be be reclassed as class 127 Gun APC (Tracked)
2) Initial availability date to be moved back to 1/1987
I have seen no indication that the relatively scarce BMP-2s were made available to the regular army in 2000. With the above changes it could play the role of the antipersonnel variant of unit 524.

Unit 268 RPG-7 Team
A clone of it should be added with the RKG-3M in slot 3 deleted.

Unit 447: RG Sappers
A clone of it should be added with the the flamethrower in slot 3 replaced by weapon n.13 7.62mm PKM LMG

Formation 15: Amphib Tank Pl

Final availability date should be changed to 4/2003. There were not amphibious tank left in service past that date. A few T-55/72/Type 69 were recovered and put back in service but no PT-76.
The new iraqi military has shown no interest in amphibious tanks.
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Old August 9th, 2009, 01:36 PM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Some changes to the tanks of the T-55 series, mostly tweaks to bring them up to specs.

There will be a similar post about the T-72s some time down the road plus an other two-three posts about miscellaneous stuff. With those this OOB should be pretty much covered in its essentials.
I will still write stuff but it is going to be more about nice to have things or if something new comes out on the current iraqi rearmament. Otherwise the basics will have been covered.

Unit 12: Type 69-II
I suggest a change in loadout
24 HE, 5 AP, 3 Sabot and 12 HEAT,. The tank is supposed to be able to carry 44 rounds according to chinese sources, given that the T-55 can carry 43 rounds that seems reasonable. The above mix would be more in line with known combat loads than a pure HE/HEAT loadout.


Unit 16: T-54B
It should be changed to a T-54A as that was the first version of T-54 supplied. That could be accomplished with the following modifications:
1)name changed to T-54A
2)reduction in stabilizer rating to 1 (see unit 7 T-54A in the russian OOB).
3)Replacing weapon n. 53 7.62 SGMT AAMG with weapon n. 54 12.7 DShK AAMG
Icon could also be changed to n. 1466 or n.712, as those two are pretty much what the iraqis used for camo most of the time: plain desert tan or desert tan with green stripes.

Unit 17-18-580 : T-54B
Some changes to bring them up to specs:
1) FC ratings should be increased from 3 to 5
(see unit 8 T-54B in the russian OOB).
2) Weapon 53 7.62 SGMT AAMG should be replaced with weapon n. 54 12.7 DShK AAMG

Unit 18 could have its icon changed to n. 1466 or n.712, as those two icons are pretty much what the iraqis used for camo most of the time: plain desert tan or desert tan with green stripes.
Also HEAT load should be reduced from 12 to 8 and HE load increased to 16, as that would be more in line with known combat loads.

Unit 19-615: T-55
It should have a BMG, weapon n. 61, added in slot 4.
Basic T-55 retained the BMG, which was deleted in T-54A (See unit 9 of the russian OOB, also confirmed by other sources such as tank-net.org).

Units 20-581-616-619: T-55A
FC rating should be increased to 7 from current 5. (See unit 10 of the russian OOB).

Unit 21: T-55 Enigma
Some changes that could be implemented:
1) Rename it “Tyepe 69 Enigma”
2) the BMG in slot 4 should be deleted, as the MG hole would be covered by the appliquè armor panels anyway.


Source: http://data.primeportal.net

3) Weapon 53 7.62 SGMT AAMG in slot 3 should be replaced by weapon 54 12.7 DShK AAMG.
4) Range finder value should be increased to 22, consistent with Type 69 II values.
5) Night vision rating should be reduced to 20.

The Enigma upgrade as fielded consisted only of the armor modules and better radios. No fire control upgrades or anything else beyond what the tank already had. It was applied indifferently to T-55 and Type 69 II, as well others T-54 derivates which were then parcelled out as command tanks.

Alternatively the name and RF ratings could be left as they are and the FC rating reduced to 7 to bring it line with
T-55A ratings, but I imagine the Type 69 II based variant would be more interesting for wargaming purposes.

Some changes for the tank guns

weapon 70 100mm D10T 55
HEAT penetration should be reduced from 38 to 28
It would represent BR-412B AP and BK-5 HEAT combination

weapon 71 100mm D10T 60
AP penetration should be reduced from 21 to 19
It would represent BR-412B AP and BK-5M HEAT combination

weapon 72 100mm D10T 69
Sabot penetration should be increased to 30 and Sabot Range to 90
It would represent BR-412D AP, BK-5M HEAT and BM-8 APDS combination.

Weaponn n. 132 100mm D10S 44 and weapon n. 130 100mm D10T 77 can be left in its current form for the time being.

I suggested the above changes on the basis of ammunition actually used by the iraqis
1) BR-412 AP round
2) BR-412B AP round
3) BR-412D AP round
4) BM-8 APDS
5) BK-5M HEAT
6) M69 HEAT
7) Clones of the above, HE.

Also it seems likely
8) BM-21 APFSDS (in limited quantities)
9) BK-5 or similar vintage, expended by 2003, HEAT

Sources for the above are mainly ordnance disposal reports and tank-net.org.

Last edited by Marcello; August 9th, 2009 at 01:45 PM..
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  #10  
Old August 10th, 2009, 05:44 AM
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Default Re: Iraqi errors report - Part 2

Quote:
Basic T-55 retained the BMG, which was deleted in T-54A
That should have been T-55A instead of T-54A.
The basic T-55 was the only main varian without AAMG, as both the previous T-54s variants and the following T-55A had them (the Dshk had ceased to be considered useful against modern aircrafts and helicopters were not yet considered a major threat, plus the whole NBC issues).
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