Nap Turns

[chrispedersen]

There are some spells, that upon casting should void a nap, at least oneway.

I would place:

Burden of Time
Arcane Nexus
Strands
Wish for Armageddon
Forge of the Ancients

In this category. Are there others?

[konming]

While BoT, Utter Dark, Astral Corruption and like should automatically void NAP, I do not see other spells end NAP unless specified clearly in NAP agreement. BoT and alike all directly damage other players (friendly or not). So it is considered offensive spell casted to your land. I do not see Arcane Nexus and especially FoA automatically end NAP. But you can always say that when you sign NAPs.

[chrispedersen]

Originally Posted by konming

While BoT, Utter Dark, Astral Corruption and like should automatically void NAP, I do not see other spells end NAP unless specified clearly in NAP agreement. BoT and alike all directly damage other players (friendly or not). So it is considered offensive spell casted to your land. I do not see Arcane Nexus and especially FoA automatically end NAP. But you can always say that when you sign NAPs.

The point isn't which spells cause attacks on the person with whom you have a NAP. Rather it is spells that are so powerful that they provide overwelming advantage, such that the terms lof a longterm nap should immediately be cancelled.

So, for example if you have a nap+8, and you are the only neighbor of someone that casts forge - the duration of your NAP is untenable.


I will definitely add Astral Corruption to the list and utterdark to the list.

[Jazzepi]

Originally Posted by chrispedersen

The point isn't which spells cause attacks on the person with whom you have a NAP. Rather it is spells that are so powerful that they provide overwelming advantage, such that the terms lof a longterm nap should immediately be cancelled.

So, for example if you have a nap+8, and you are the only neighbor of someone that casts forge - the duration of your NAP is untenable.


I will definitely add Astral Corruption to the list and utterdark to the list.

You might as well add "if you expand faster than me" to the reasons for NAPs to be automatically canceled. If you're justification is that your opponent has cast a spell that gives them some sort of advantage in their growth rate over your own in terms of raw power, then you should just abandon the idea of forming an NAP in the first place. The whole point of an NAP with another person is that you're gambling that you can grow faster than them in the long run. OR that you're growing faster than them in the short run, and then you can cancel it and attack them.

Jazzepi

[Xietor]

While you will never get a consensus, i will say this: Casting the Forge could well have your allies with naps attacking you the very next turn.

And no one will blame them. Whether it ends naps or not is the subject for scholarly debate, but casting the Forge without being able to fight the world, or without having told your friends and gotten their ok is a mistake.

[chrispedersen]

Originally Posted by Jazzepi

You might as well add "if you expand faster than me" to the reasons for NAPs to be automatically canceled. If you're justification is that your opponent has cast a spell that gives them some sort of advantage in their growth rate over your own in terms of raw power, then you should just abandon the idea of forming an NAP in the first place. The whole point of an NAP with another person is that you're gambling that you can grow faster than them in the long run. OR that you're growing faster than them in the short run, and then you can cancel it and attack them.

Jazzepi

Jazz, some people will not break a nap regardless of consequence. So I am trying to provoke discussion of what a nap entails, and craft a nap that
a) has a consensus of understanding of what it entails.
b) handles issues of current concern.

I get that none of this is of value to you. If you're (generic you, not you personally) going to break a nap, it doesn't matter what the terms are. However, if you intend to keep it, then there are certain common circumstances that should be thought about, and perhaps be reason for an out.

[chrispedersen]

Forging chalice is impossible to confirm, in most cases. Aka, you can know its been forged, but you generally don't know who has it until a stack of tartarians shows up on your door step.

So, nah I'd not add it.

[konming]

Originally Posted by chrispedersen

The point isn't which spells cause attacks on the person with whom you have a NAP. Rather it is spells that are so powerful that they provide overwelming advantage, such that the terms lof a longterm nap should immediately be cancelled.

So, for example if you have a nap+8, and you are the only neighbor of someone that casts forge - the duration of your NAP is untenable.


I will definitely add Astral Corruption to the list and utterdark to the list.

If you think FoA or AN are too powerful a spell for NAPs to continue, you should listed them when NAPs were agreed to. Otherwise, it is a breach of NAP and badboy points are assessed against you.

[Edratman]

I agree with Konmeg. By no stretch can Forge or Arcane Nexus be considered a violation. Might as well forbid all forging, summoning and recruiting.

I would think any spell that causes damage or hinders some aspect is a violation of a NAP, even if it is a global.

[thejeff]

If I was a water nation, I would consider Sea of Ice a violation, at least if I hadn't been consulted.
How about the random attack ones? Not that they're cast very often in MP, but Wild Hunt, the random lightning strikes one and isn't the Ghost admiral a global?

Dispelling a global would be a violation? How about stealing one? Casting a different global that overwrites yours due to a lack of slots shouldn't be, but overcasting the same one?