vengeance of the dead, how it works with 1000+ ?

[triqui]

Hi!
I have been the target of the vengeance of the Dead spell this turn. Several times. Each round of the spell, i killed each and every ghost, but the problem is that the next round, each and every ghost killed count as a dead by the SC, so each and every round, the number of ghosts double.

What happens when there are 1000, 2000 or 9999999 ghosts? (assuming i can kill them all). Is the game stalled at round 75? I die? (i guess the ghosts dont run or break morale in round 50, do they?)

[Omnirizon]

brain: pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?

pinky: i think so brain, but those kind of girls aren't into that.

brain: pinky, don't you think we're stigmatized enough as it is?

pinky:...

brain: I'm going to give an SC the Sickle Who's Crop is Pain, then have someone cast VotD on them. can you just imagine the death gem income you'd get turn after turn!?!

pinky: Egadz brain! NARF!

[kasnavada]

Hum, I read the other thread you resurected. It sums things up nicely...

The only counter I can see to that is
- using the "returning" spell until your opponent runs out of gems or get tired of trying to blast him,
- teleport your SC every turn until your opponent gets tired of trying to blast him (and hope the teleport ritual happens before the VotD ritual),
- have a stealthy SC. I don't know of any item that can give stealth though...

Either way, your opponent countered a SC with half a dozen cheap mages...

[Zeldor]

Omnirizon:

Hmm... that Sickle idea is brilliant, if it works it is rather a bug though or at least exploit that should be blocked in game.

[BesucherXia]

Hmm...
I will suggest changing the Sickle so it can never harvest gems from mindless units, who are obviously out of "pain".

[vfb]

IMO Vengeance of the Dead is buggy too, for including undead kills in its dead count. It's the souls of the dead you slew coming back to haunt you. So when you double up, where the heck did those extra undead come from?

I think it's unfair to cast this again if the unit you are trying to kill survives. Once is fair game though.

Vengeance does have an MR check, so you should do what you can to increase your MR to reduce your chances of being affected.

Undead are immune, so if you're really desperate you could use Twiceborn and kill yourself.

[Omnirizon]

vfb said:
IMO Vengeance of the Dead is buggy too, for including undead kills in its dead count. It's the souls of the dead you slew coming back to haunt you. So when you double up, where the heck did those extra undead come from?

Its the same mechanics as reincarnation. If reincarnation is true, than how does the population of the world increase? The person living now is only the soul of someone who lived before. They don't die and create a soul of their present life in addition to their last one. So as population increases, where are all the extra souls coming from?

[triqui]

vfb said:
Vengeance does have an MR check, so you should do what you can to increase your MR to reduce your chances of being affected.

That's not an option, it will die next turn , mathematically

I liked the Sickle of crop idea, though. A nice exploit to answer against a exploit i guess

[Cor2]

vfb said:
IMO Vengeance of the Dead is buggy too, for including undead kills in its dead count. It's the souls of the dead you slew coming back to haunt you. So when you double up, where the heck did those extra undead come from?

When you wack a soul of a previous victim they split into two equal souls. I thought this was obvious! We all know that there is no law of conservation of souls!

[NTJedi]

triqui said:
Is the game stalled at round 75? I die? (i guess the ghosts dont run or break morale in round 50, do they?)

It's my understanding the undead from the dream do not flee at turn 50... thus at turn 75 your mage/commander flees and is auto-killed.


This has a few issues which are just logically wrong:
1) Being auto-killed while fleeing during an assassination. Historically and logically incorrect.

2) Successfully fleeing during a dream should at worst cause the target to awaken... maybe with the battle fright affliction.

3) Killing these undead within a dream should not count as kills. This results in one soul being doubled or tripled and appearing in future VotD castings.

4) The battle turn limits... as I understand are 50 the attacker retreats, 75 defender retreats and 100 all attackers are killed. As computers become more and more powerful it would be nice if us gamers had the option of adjusting the battle turn limits. Currently every game we play has this all powerful organized union which forces non-golem attackers to retreat at 5pm... and then forces non-golem defenders to retreat at 8pm. I hate this organized union.