Uk's MBT-LAW

loktarr · #1 April 17th, 2007, 01:51 PM

It's disponible in-game in 2007, as planned by Uk's ministry of defense, is it true?
I'm amazed by this missile because it's a TA-ATGM and it has a better penetration than a maverick! Has anybody confirmation than this missile is already in service and so efficient?
I just discovered it when playing against a player with germany in 2007; his poor Leo II were disabled in a few turns, without any possibility to strike back!

loktarr · #2 April 17th, 2007, 05:08 PM

It is unit 235, even if I didn't ask for any change...

DRG · #3 April 17th, 2007, 05:20 PM

It's a top attack missle. They do attack the weakest bits on a tank

Don

loktarr · #4 April 17th, 2007, 05:54 PM

Quote:

DRG said:

It's a top attack missile. They do attack the weakest bits on a tank

Don

That's just why I miss the interess of being able to penetrate 150cm of anti-HEAT armour when best roof are around 20cm, and that no DC-ATGM are able to penetrate a so great thickness... Why not give them such a warhead (in game, best DC have a 100 to 120 penetration, against face hull/turret up to 170 in the worst case)
But if I understand you correctly, this value is just in-game to assure a more frequent success of this weapon, maybe because of a better system or something else?

In fact what shocks me is that it seems pretty unlogical to have such a warhead, when only a 5 times smaller is needed...

Cheers
Loktarr

DRG · #5 April 17th, 2007, 07:03 PM

So it's not the fact that it can kill just about anything it's fired at it's the number we choose to represent that fact that's bothering you. Tell you what...... you find me hard info on the actual armour penetration of a Bofors MBT-LAW and I'll read it and if we are wrong. I'll fix it

OK?

Don

loktarr · #6 April 17th, 2007, 08:07 PM

Quote:

DRG said:
So it's not the fact that it can kill just about anything it's fired at it's the number we choose to represent that fact that's bothering you.
Don

It doesn't bother me and I never asked for modifications of game values; my question was if the value was the consequence of a revolutionar penetrator or "the fact that it can kill just about anything it's fired at": your present answer is the only thing I asked for.
Now, if you want to know if I think that this value is too high, my is NO, because I never saw any MBT-LAW in action, probably never will and my guess is that some of the OOB maker did.
Thank you for your answer and sorry , but I was just trying to understand something, not to upset you.
Loktarr

SGTGunn · #7 May 7th, 2007, 01:58 PM

The MBT LAW apparently uses the same warhead (or one based on) as the Bofors Bill 2.

http://www.global-defence.com/2006/U...icle.php?id=30

http://www.army-technology.com/projects/mbt_law/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MBT_LAW

The RBS-56B Bill 2 weapon number 152 obat66 - Sweden has a heat penetration of 100, so my guess is that the MBT LAW should have a similar value.

It's an easy fix for anyone interested - just pop into MOBHACK and make the change =)

Adrian

dmnt · #8 March 12th, 2015, 06:04 AM

MBT LAW indeed seems to have too good penetration values now.
NLAW at FDF site states that the penetration is >500 mm (RHAe?) and net weight of explosively formed penetrator is 1.8 kg.

Comparing to RBS-56 Bill2 and it's 110mm (main) warhead the NLAW has smaller, 102mm warhead. Simple calculation with scaling gives that NLAW supposedly has 79.7% warhead size and/or effect. Assuming penetration of 100 cm for Bill2 (as in the Swedish OOB) we have 80 cm for NLAW.

Comparing to APILAS, that has a 1.5 kg warhead and 720 mm RHAe penetration and again simply scaling (although APILAS is older tech) gives 864 mm for NLAW.

In the end we have something that has heavier warhead than APILAS but probably smaller than Bill2. Current 100 HEAT pen might be a bit high, 85 could probably be closer as it is smaller detonator than the one in RBS-56B (Bill 2).

PvtJoker · #9 March 12th, 2015, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmnt

Comparing to APILAS, that has a 1.5 kg warhead and 720 mm RHAe penetration and again simply scaling (although APILAS is older tech) gives 864 mm for NLAW.

The APILAS has a 112 mm warhead, which means that the shaped charge cone diameter is probably somewhat larger than in the NLAW. That might more or less cancel out the fact that the APILAS is older tech. Also, the NLAW being a top attack weapon is probably not 100% optimized for penetration, since MBTs rarely have very thick armor on the top. My guess is that the actual penetration might be no more than 600-700 mm RHAe, but with enhanced behind armor effects over purely penetration optimized warheads.

The 720 mm for the APILAS is quite optimistic, by the way. Lower figures have also been floating around; 650 mm appeared in some sources. Considering that the APILAS is from the same generation as the I-TOW and the latter has recently been found falling quite short of the old 800 mm marketing figure, I have a strong feeling that 650 mm is closer to the truth than 720 mm...

FASTBOAT TOUGH · #10 March 12th, 2015, 10:03 PM

I've posted OPFOR items here before, so if you have looked at them in the past, you should remember if we own it, buy it or capture it we'll break it down, figure it out, test it, shoot it and evaluate it. Yeah just like any other army should if it wants to figure out how effective the weapon system is especially against your own equipment so you can figure out how to make them less effective. So to help take some of the guess work out of this topic Ileave you with the following information.
1. From the author...
A. If in the tables it doesn't say it's RHA then it isn't RHA armor.
B. Using IPAD so I can't "copy" the website (Yes I'm sure you can but, not to be rude but, I don't care.) so bear with me.
C. Sample item: APILAS/122mm/HEAT/@330mm=720mm Pen./ReinConcrete 2000mm Pen.
D. For all weapons shown look to lower right side of column for any armor pen values including for each type of ammo used by the weapon.

Google searched for "armor penetration tables for top attack attack atom" on first page about 3 down the following came up "PDF Worldwide Equipment Guide"
fas.org/man/Dod-101/sys/land/row/weg2001.PDF

Page 1-8.6 starts you on the road.

Today we started our annual Spring Training trip we would arrive @ the bottom of the 7th inning and see my team score 9 runs to win the game 11 to 9. The reason we were late was because about 25 miles of I-95S was completely shutdown because of three accidents within a few miles of each other. Those that know the road know that's drastic, I would simply ask for your "positive thoughts" for those involved.

Now quit posting about things I like to look into please!?!

Regards,
Pat