SK-105 probs

[Siddhi]

It looks like the SK-105 Kurassier is lacking the OFL 105 G1 SABOT round, at least going on performance - on about 10 hits on a t-72A with the G-105mm cannon (frontal) i have not had a single penetration, however the OFL 105 G1 SABOT is supposed to penetrate Nato tripple heavy target with 550mm penetration, the t-72A has the equivilant of ca. 440mm armour - so no problem, in theory. How however am I going to get the OFL 105 G1 SABOT into the game?

Also, the SK-105 has a "double barrel" autoloader which on the one hand allows the first 12 shots to be fired in 4-5 second intervals, OTOH however requires reloading from the main drum after the rounds are fired (40 rounds can be carried in total). If I tried to incorpoerate this, how would I proceed?

[narwan]

Siddhi said:
It looks like the SK-105 Kurassier is lacking the OFL 105 G1 SABOT round, at least going on performance - on about 10 hits on a t-72A with the G-105mm cannon (frontal) i have not had a single penetration, however the OFL 105 G1 SABOT is supposed to penetrate Nato tripple heavy target with 550mm penetration, the t-72A has the equivilant of ca. 440mm armour - so no problem, in theory. How however am I going to get the OFL 105 G1 SABOT into the game?

Also, the SK-105 has a "double barrel" autoloader which on the one hand allows the first 12 shots to be fired in 4-5 second intervals, OTOH however requires reloading from the main drum after the rounds are fired (40 rounds can be carried in total). If I tried to incorpoerate this, how would I proceed?

The Kurassier available from '93 onward has sabot rounds with an APCR of 56. Could that be what you're referring to?

As to the autoloaders, the same problem more or less exists with all autoloaders in the game. They have a limited amount ready in the drums while the rest must be retrieved from within the vehicle. This should give the units a variable ROF (not to mention the limited selection from the ready ammo drums) but I don't think realistically feasible in the game system. Best and most simple solutions would be to base the ROF not on the speed of fire from ready drums but on the average for firing off the entire ammo load.

Narwan

[DRG]

There are 5 "SK-105's" in the game and one "Kurassier" in three nations. Plus four "Kuerassier" in two nations and two named "Sk 105" .

The ones equipped with the latest gun can penetrate 56CM of armour with their Sabot

Knowing which one you are referring to would be most helpful

Don

[Marcello]

I do not know the specific doctrine for the SK-105 (or the AMX-13, which has the same issues) but it looks like an ambush weapon to me. Get in a good position, fire a few shots, get out and reload the autoloaders in a quiet place. That and maybe some infantry support. Not something meant to slug it out in the open battlefield for an extended period of time. Besides 4-5 seconds does not make it a 105mm machinegun.

[PlasmaKrab]

Also, the SK-105 has a "double barrel" autoloader which on the one hand allows the first 12 shots to be fired in 4-5 second intervals, OTOH however requires reloading from the main drum after the rounds are fired (40 rounds can be carried in total). If I tried to incorpoerate this, how would I proceed?

Looks like starting up an old debate all over again...
I'm all in favor of autoloaders per se (and also of intricately modelling technical tidbits ), but I kind of concur to the point that in the scale of the game, autoloader or not make no difference.

First thing, the gun ROF itself makes little difference since in combat conditions, the crew proficiency has a much bigger influence on the actual firing rate. Consider that even before the autoloader (or absence thereof) kicks in the firing sequence, the crew has to spot and aim a target. That factors in a number of other variables: crew communication, FC system, rate of turn of the turret and gun mantle, rangefinding... So even if the loading is automated, so many other operations critical to the firing process are handled directly by the crew, that the experience rating gets the upper hand, and for good reasons IMHO.

To make a long story short, take e.g. a K�rassier in Austrian service (or a Strv-103 in Swedish service) on one hand, and on the other, say, the same K�rassier in Tunisian service (no offense meant to anyone, that's just for the sake of the argument).
Even if the automation ensures that both rounds are loaded in the chamber in the same time, the assumed better training of here, the better training of Austrian crewmen will mean that they won't take as long to spot, target and engage the same target in combat conditions.

Hope that was clear enough...

[Marek_Tucan]

Marcello said:
I do not know the specific doctrine for the SK-105 (or the AMX-13, which has the same issues) but it looks like an ambush weapon to me. Get in a good position, fire a few shots, get out and reload the autoloaders in a quiet place. That and maybe some infantry support. Not something meant to slug it out in the open battlefield for an extended period of time. Besides 4-5 seconds does not make it a 105mm machinegun.

Yup, seems like an ambush weapon to me (though AMX-13's were able to duke it out even with T-54's but then it was thanks to crew proficiency on one side and (relative) lack thereof on the other) but I guess the 4-5sec ROF isn't too practical in combat (except if you are zeroed on a big and relatively immobile target you need to suppress) - I'd say new target acquisition would take roughly the same as on any other tank and thus practical ROF would be similar.

[Shan]

You're right, Marek, that's how it should e used. As it lacks a stabilizer and - before 1998 -also had very primitive sights (except for laser rangefinder, but otherwise... like WW2), it's quite suicidal to do any other thing with it but delay. Its semi-auto-loader, however, gives it an awesome firepower in an ambush situation - a platoon would easily be able to stop a company-sized or larger force, then withdraw, re-deploy and play the game again. A well-trained crew would be able to use the ROF AND hit something as well.