Dominions 3: Speculation Wars

[B0rsuk]

Hey !
This topic has three purposes:
1) To have fun
2) to predict some facts about Dominions 3
3) To provoke developers into repplying.

I will start. Basing on some info from various posts, including Wishlist and Faq threads http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...=&fpart=1&vc=1
It is confirmed that each theme is a separate nation, actually. And the nations are divided into 3 eras (early, mid, late for lack of better name). It is safe to assume that themes/factions from two different eras will never meet each other in unmodded game.

Assumption1: It will now be possible to take, say, Diabolical Faith (Marignon) and Restless Worshippers. Themes now considered special will probably be able to be augmented with extra dominion types, water cult, desert sun, etc.

Assumption2: Let's do some guesswork and see which era does each theme belong to.

Early Mid Late
Ermor: Broken Empire > Soul Gate/Ashen empire ?
Pythium - marsh people before Ermor came> regular Pythium > ?
Regular Pangaea > "Iron" Pangaea > Carrion Woods ?
C'tis Desert Tombs > normal C'tis > ?
Golden Era > Arcoscephale > ?
Niefelheim > Jotunheim > Utgard ?
?? > Abysia > Blood of Humans
??? > Marignon/Fires > Conquerors/Diabolical
? > Ulm > Black Faith/Black Forest
Spring&Autumn/Barbarian Kings > Tien Chi > ?
Last of the Tuatha > Man > ?
Poor Machaka > Pitiful Machaka > Corrupted Machaka (see modern Africa for reference on last one)
Raptors > Caelum > ?



Assumption3: Some themes may be removed. Which and why ?
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[Kuritza_Dru]

My 5 cents...

Pythium with C'Tis (sauromancers helping the Theurgs) > Serpent cult / Pythium. Dunno in which order. Perhaps second era is about 'sauromancers are gone, but there are still some serpent temples around', and the third one is a 'pure' Pythium. At least I wouldn't like tho think that Theurg's litanias aren't offered in great Cathedrals anymore.
Desert tombs > C'Tis > Miasma, with Tombs not as a 'return of the ancient Kings' theme, but as an 'Ancient nation obsessed with Life after Death' thingy. More Egypt please.
Golden Era - Alexandria - Arcoscephale.
We have seen Arco as an old (tired) Empire and we've seen that land in its time of legends. Now its time to play a Hellinistic Empire at its prime.
Diabolical Faith / Marignon / Conquerors.
When the first waves of the Undead overwhelmed the outer defenses, great fear arose. While the most devout priests were sacrificing their live at the front lines, others were... sacrificing others lives to get help from an even more sinister source. Heresy took some time to weed off, but eventually the Inquisition was founded and succeeded in both dealing with both keeping the Death at bay and weeding out the blasphemy.
First of the Tuatha > Man > Last of the Tuatha.

[Ironhawk]

Kuritza_Dru said:
First of the Tuatha > Man > Last of the Tuatha.

How about...

Last of the Tuatha > Man > The Tuatha Strikes Back!!!

[Alneyan]

Nay, it's not quite that : Last of the Tuathas, Man, Barbarian Kings, in that order. You know, *those* greenish Barbarians that swarm across the pond.

Speaking of Barbarian Kings, I would put it right at the end, rather than before the main theme: it seems to fit their history and history better.

[Endoperez]

Post 388426 in the Wishlist thread has some more information:

Kristoffer O.:
The number of nations is tricky. Themes are reworked and put into the three ages. Niefelheim becomes Jotunheim in the middle era and is Utg�rd in the late era. Some nations do not exist in some eras etc. What earlier was a theme is now considered a nation in its own right which makes modding much easier. Thus I do not know exactly how may nations there will be, but about 60 is probably right. Entirely new ones (with early and late versions excluded) there are perhaps ten new ones. Sauromatia is very different from Pythium, but could be considered an early version. They do have Hydras, but Witch Kings are very different from Arch theurgs. Likewise Yomi is quite different from the later form Shinuyama and the last "nipponese" nation Jomon. The semblances between early middle and late Caelum are stronger.

Yomi -> Shinuyama -> Jomon

Vanheim is probably
Helheim - Vanheim - Midg�rd

My quess that there are some alternative timelines. As an example, Ulm can be either Black Forest or Black Steel, and those exist in the same era (I think). Marignon, Ulm and Pythium didn't exist before the Cataclysm (undead Ermor themes). Marignon turned to priesthood to keep the undead at bay, Ulm abandoned magic and Pythium tries to hold the memory of the old ways.

I except Middle Era to be quite similar to base themes. I think Early Era is more about units and less about humans and more about raw power than magic (with the Vanir, the Tuatha, the Niefel etc around). There could be exceptions (Spring&Autumn, Golden Era in a way), but I think really powerful magic will be mainly Late Era. With at least one undead theme of Ermor, Black Forest, whatever Late version of Mictlan is, possibly Miasma, Utg�rd... Also, I think Humans will become more common as the time goes by, as seen in Blood of Humans and Utg�rd. However, the human nations themselves will also change, to interesting directions... Maybe more corrupted humans along the lines of Black Forest and Diabolical Faith?

I don't know much about Machaka or Africa, but it and Mictlan could become very interesting later on...

[Nerfix]

I think early Mictlan will be the Mictlan of the "pure" era, no blood sacrifices.

[Endoperez]

If anything, that would be the middle Era. "Mictlan is an ancient kingdom. Since the dawn of the kingdom, blood has been spilled in the temples of the capital. For a brief period of time, blood sacrifices were banned by a king called Lawgiver, but now..." from the description.


Has anyone wondered why Dominions players are pretty contempt with what they have? While recently there have been more threads about DomIII, the topic hasn't been given much thought. Also, I think this is the first thread ever started so that people could quess what DomIII will be like. This is also very spesific, unlike the Wishlist, and asks for speculation, unlike most threads about DomIII.

[Kristoffer O]

> 1) To have fun

I have.

> 2) to predict some facts about Dominions 3

I have.

> 3) To provoke developers into repplying.

I have.



You are on the right track, with some mistakes of course.

Keep on guessing. I like it


Some themes are merged.

[B0rsuk]

Endoperez said:
Has anyone wondered why Dominions players are pretty contempt with what they have? While recently there have been more threads about DomIII, the topic hasn't been given much thought. Also, I think this is the first thread ever started so that people could quess what DomIII will be like. This is also very spesific, unlike the Wishlist, and asks for speculation, unlike most threads about DomIII.

The point is... um. I don't have Dominions2. I own only demo.
Ocassionally I go to my friend who's got full version, and we pretend we can finish one game in just one evening. Then we start another game, because by the time we see each other again we tend to forget what was the game about. And where all the scouts are (*B0rsuk looks at Kristoffer/JK in a threatening manner*).
So I mostly play demo. You can still have some fun with it. Eventually news of Dominions3 reached me. It made me uneasy about buying full Dominions2, because it would become obsolete - more less.

However, there's one BIG obstacle for me buying Dominions3, and I'm quite worried about it. Dom2 is being sold (to my knowledge) by shipment only, and it is very, very hard to find a way of transfering money abroad. Banks in Poland don't support it, generally speaking. I know because I recently did a research (I was going to buy full new version of DROD). My internet bank doesn't allow transfer to other countries, so I would have to
1. Create an account elsewhere (it costs)
2. Allow them to charge me (about) 50zl just for transfering money abroad
3. Pay for Dominions, which would be something like 40$ = 120zl.
This means at least 190zl - assuming I can set up an account for free (unlikely). To compare, my half-time job gets me circa 650zl monthly, and I didn't mention paying for studies (2400zl/6months), food, clothing, etc. I would gladly pay the equivalent of 40$ for the game, but I'd be mercilessly ripped, and there's lots of beaurocracy in my way. I hate beaurocracy. My friend was lucky, he was in the USA last year.
If you didn't get it at this point, B0rsuk is very frustrated.

Kristoffer: Thanks, you've been very helpful ! Your insights are very inspiring.

I wonder if ability to take "special" theme and, say, Restless Worshippers would really change anything. I just learned hard way that not taking Order/Productivity is effectively a suicide. And there are some themes with Sloth/Turmoil...ugh.

[Vicious Love]

I think we've been pointedly ignoring the real topic of this thread for long enough. Not like all those other nations were ever more than a thin smokescreen, anyway. Let me just get us back on track:

R'lyeh. Discuss.

Last I heard, there were aboleths involved.