Why Gift of Reason?

[Vger]

Hi,

OK, I'm playing R'lyeh and just had a Vastness show up at the Void Gate. I gave him (it?) Gift of Reason. Now, I did get research of 6 and Astral 3 out of that, but he can't carry anything, even misc, so am I missing something? I don't see a big benefit of having done that.

I do realize he can command troops and also that there may be several marvelous Astral spells he can cast before attacking, but I expected something more.

So, in short: Why use gift of reason?

Thanks,
V'ger gone

[Saber Cherry]

I find it's best for humanoids. But sometimes I use in on Sea Serpents, too, for example. It's nice to have commanders that you won't lose easily, and sometimes, undead or mindless commanders.

[Taqwus]

In the case of a Vastness, mobility plus the lack of need for a magical commander. The Vastness is capable of moving 10 provinces per turn or even underwater, but if it's a unit can only do so under the command of a commander with similar mobility and magical leadership. Such mobility tends to be rare (Horrors, if memory serves, have similar amount, but the only guaranteed way to get, say, a Doom Horror that fights for you instead of killing everybody is a Wish), and most magical commanders aren't quite as buff. If you lost all magical commanders when attacking with a non-commander Vastness, you'd lose the Vastness too.

[Vger]

Hi,

Thanks for the feedback. So, basically, it keeps me from losing him if my commanders buy it. OK, gotcha.

So, is a Vastness good enough to go out on his own as an SC? Since he can only buff by Astral spells and no items, I wondered.

Now, off to inspect his casting choices,
V'ger gone

[Mortifer]

Originally posted by Taqwus:
In the case of a Vastness, mobility plus the lack of need for a magical commander. The Vastness is capable of moving 10 provinces per turn or even underwater, but if it's a unit can only do so under the command of a commander with similar mobility and magical leadership. Such mobility tends to be rare (Horrors, if memory serves, have similar amount, but the only guaranteed way to get, say, a Doom Horror that fights for you instead of killing everybody is a Wish), and most magical commanders aren't quite as buff. If you lost all magical commanders when attacking with a non-commander Vastness, you'd lose the Vastness too.

Exactly.

PS. I LOVE the void gate!

[Humer]

Originally posted by Vger:

So, is a Vastness good enough to go out on his own as an SC? Since he can only buff by Astral spells and no items, I wondered.

First, one thing needs to be brought into daylight - the order in which following effects are checked: etherealness(1), astral shield(2), blood curse (3, V's special ability), Luck(4), Twist Fate(5). Insights anyone?

I'd put my money on "1->4->5->3->2". Assuming this, V IS rather nasty to think about:
Cast Luck, Cast Twist Fate. Now, 3/4 of non-magic weapon hits are ignored, 50% of those that hit are further ignored, blood curse MR check or hit self, astral shield MR check for paralyze.

They can rout small armies by themselves, just beware magical weapons! 0 prot, 79 hp can get you killed fast, blood curse or no. So pick your fights: Deep strikes into enemy provinces, taxes to 200% and be off or hang around hunting slaves or pillage a turn if you think you can pull it off. Other SC's will kill your V (magic weapons, high MR).

They do gain experince and if they get 'Heroic quickness'... And you can empower them (earth for the *skin path, nature for regeneration).

No items is a serious problem (from SC point of view), since V's do not grow on trees. I'd guesstimate about 2 V's/30 turns...

And then there's magic duel. 3 astral isn't much.

- Humer