Poland OOB
 

Formation 278, Naval inf CO-M, consists of three naval infantry platoons, formations 280. Should be three formation 277s, naval inf pl-M.

Re: Poland OOB
 

FIXED. Thanks

Re: Poland OOB
 

Poland signed an agreement to buy Leopard 2A5 tanks from Germany, in November 2013. They are said to be ready for service, so we might expect them from mid-2014.

Re: Poland OOB
 

By the end of 2014, 77 Leopards 2A5 are expected.

Re: Poland OOB
 

You'll find that and the newer Leopard 2A4 they also bought addressed in my last inputs for 2013/2014 in the Patch page thread.

Regards,
Pat

Re: Poland OOB
 

Poland to upgrade Leo 2A4 to Leo 2PL:
http://www.defence24.com/312490,leop...n-battle-tanks

It's a long, good article going into details. In short:

• Deliveries planned in 2017-2020: 2017 prototypes (2 tanks), 2018 18 tanks (6+12 by two factories), 2019-2020 the majority (all together to 128 tanks) and in 2021 the remaining last ones (14 tanks).
• Upgraded L44 cannon to support DM63A1 Sabot ammunition as well as programmable DM11 HE ammunition.
• 3 tons of armor increase for turret, none for hull. Turret ballistic protection level to be higher than 2A5 standard.
• New stabilizer, fire control, vision systems (2A7 levels)
• Safety system upgrades for the crew

Re: Poland OOB
 

Leopard 2PL

Here are photos of polish modernised Leopard 2A4 to version Leopard 2PL

http://i.imgur.com/q4jiQVl.jpg

There is also article in polish but translated with google translator what systems were modernised
https://translate.google.pl/translat...-text=&act=url


PT-16

Proposed modernisation package for older T-72 and PT-91 to bring them closer to leopard standard as for now is a demonstrator only Polish army isn't certain that will modernised this older tanks.

Photo
http://i.imgur.com/hivatwU.jpg

https://aw.my.com/en/forum/showthrea...05-Leopard-2PL

Re: Poland OOB
 

In this month (November 2016) to polish army were added new training/second class attack aircraft’s

Alenia Aermacchi M-346 Master polish codename "Bielik"
http://polska-zbrojna.pl/imageslibra...GetImage/41018

Aircraft with polish markings on top of wings they were introduced in 2012 but were absent from 1944 (soviet WWII tradition) until 2012 when reintroduced on F-16 first time since 1939

official website (polish language)
http://www.m-346.com/

Movie with polish camo and insignias aircraft
http://www.m-346.com/dla-mediow/aktu...wloskim-niebie

That remind me that is possible to add in polish OOB COIN aircrafts formation.
In 1946-1959 were used Po-2 and polish license build CSS-13 especially in actions against post AK underground for attack with small bombs and liaison.
Then period 1957 to 1965 PZL TS-8 Bies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_TS-8_Bies
number of yak-11 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yakovlev_Yak-11
and yak-18 https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jak-18 used for pilots training only but in case of WWIII were consider as a last and worst reserve for light attacks

And after 1964 until now we have times of PZL TS-11 Iskra Poland was only Warsaw pact country which produced own jet trainer instead use chosen by USSR Czechoslovakian L-29 Albatros. They were also sold to Indian AF

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_TS-11_Iskra

In SPMBT we have icons of Iskra in polish and indian painting already included in shp file and master icon list

In meantime were introduced new model PZL I-22 Iryda to replace Iskra's but has some faults+bad management of whole program 8 were completed and used 19 never fully finished on production line all retried in 1996
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_I-22_Iryda

for basic training but with some elements of fighting has some 4 hard points for armament max 250kg all so can be used in COIN combat mission is used since 1992 PZL-130 Orlik https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL-130_Orlik


So Iskra remain until now and will be replaced by this new Italian aircraft

Re: Poland OOB
 

026 Leopard 2PL - of course, like most of Polish AFV upgrade programs, it remained in plans only as for now :(
However, since mid-2014 Poland operates regular ex-German Leopard 2A5 (what I indicated three years ago), with better armour, which should definitely replace Leopard 2PL (photo is correct). They also use Polish-made HE ammo, like unit 023.

023 Leopard 2A4P - it's a detail, but it has inexplicable big weight. 2A4P seems not real designation (it was possibly some planned upgrade), but it represents the tank with HE ammo.

037 Krab - first battery was about to be delivered only in 11/2012 (Polish article: http://www.altair.com.pl/news/view?news_id=8763&q=krab). Earlier there existed prototypes in a factory, so probably the first date should be changed. Same for 759 Krab Platoon.

Finally, by 8/2017 there was delivered a complete battalion (on new chassis) and orders speeded up, so this unit should be duplicated with an ordinary radio code from that date. It is also known as AHS Krab (''armato-haubica samobieżna'' - SP gun-howitzer), but it doesn't seem official designation

In July 2017 the first batch of 120mm SP-mortars Rak was delivered - http://www.army-technology.com/proje...mortar-system/ (Rosomak chassis, something similar to Russian #595 2S23 Nona-SVK), other photos: http://iu.wp.mil.pl/userfiles/image/regi3.jpg

That's all with news as for now. We could add newest brainchild of our (suspected...) MoD, a OT infantry (territorial defence), being a bunch of weekend amateurs with newest MSBS Grot rifles, but I wouldn't bother... (http://www.defence24.com/664005,msbs...apons-analysis). Unless we'd just copy a standard infantry squad and platoon organization and give them much less experience, maybe a bit more morale. Maybe it should be added in the future, since it seems to be a lasting element of the Polish Army..

btw: weapon #07 wz.88 Tanta AR is a typo, should be Tantal AR.

misc: unit 958 Orlik has a jet icon, while it is a prop plane (upper view: http://mazuryairshow.pl/wp-content/u...lik-scheme.png, http://i.iplsc.com/pzl-130-orlik-tc-...B6-C322-F4.jpg). Might be replaced with something generic (the best: grey), since they are rather not important, and their COIN use is highly speculative.

Re: Poland OOB
 

A look back explained, that it first was a speculative tank with missiles. Therefore it should be named just Leopard 2A4 (or A4+, like unit 022) (or other name to indicate HE ammo). BTW, HE ammo was accepted in 12/2012, and entered full-scale production from 2014, so this tank might need a half-year shift (now starts in 6/12).

Unfortunately, Polish Leopards have too good ammo in the game (sabot pen. 86). In fact they used only German old DM33A1 (in German oob penetration 70, if it is weapon #100 120mm L44 WG87).

Only from 2015 there has been delivered mysterious Polish Mesko-manufactured APFSDS-T (no name, sometimes credited as Pz.531). There is an information, that it offers at least 500 mm RHA penetration (http://promilitaria21.home.pl/autoin...pfsds-t-120-mm ).

The same ammo is used be Leo 2A5. However, there was also a mention in one article, that along with Leo 2A5 there arrived a small emergency batch of "modern" ammo...

--------

Mi-24 helicopters:

It appeared, that Polish Mi-24s run out of (obsolete) AT missiles by 2012 (article in Polish https://www.trojmiasto.pl/wiadomosci...i-n106076.html).

So, units 124 Mi-24D and 125 Mi-24W should end at 12/12 at best (Mi-24D weren't withdrawn by then).
BTW, proper icon for 125 Mi-24W is 3494, used for all terrains.
Also 124 Mi-24D should use the same icon 3487 for all.

126 Mi-24D - should be available until some 2022 (they are still in use), icon 3487 for all (rocket-only armed camouflaged Mi-24D helicopters were used in Iraq in 2004-2008).

098 Mi-24W - it differs in a higher TI/GSR 40, but in fact none of Polish Mi-24 had modernized aiming systems, so I believe it should be standard 30.

At least since 2004, Mi-24 after refit are painted green (icon 3485), so I suggest to make this unit available from 2004, with green icon and no missiles.

photos of green ones: https://skrzydla.org/photos/2010-11-20/80605.jpg
http://pzdata.cdn.aikelo.com/pzdata2/Images/25498
http://s3.flog.pl/media/foto/1857256...idok-mozna.jpg

There should be also created a variant with two underwing 23mm GSh-23L guns (weapon #187) - they were probably used since beginning, but got more popular on photos only last times. So I suggest it should be based upon green Mi-24W, available since 2004. Although photos usually show them with two gun pods only, they probably can carry half of their 57mm rockets as well.

(photo http://www.defence24.pl/uploads/imag...a64fb8afb9.jpg)

Re: Poland OOB
 

Re: Poland OOB
 

Beautiful :up:

I must admit, I haven't checked progress in Leopard 2PL program, since they aren't in service yet. However, they were already ordered and deliveries of pre-series tanks are expected from 6/18.

The turret armour is said to be better, than in 2A5. Some claim, that it is 2A7 level (Polish article: http://www.nowastrategia.org.pl/demo...o-leopard-2pl/), but this article http://www.military-today.com/tanks/leopard_2pl.htm says "it offers higher protection than turret of the Leopard 2A5, however it can not match protection level of the Leopard 2A7".
Now turret front anti-HEAT is much worse than 2A5 (130 vs 185). Turret extra sides are thicker, than in A5, and might be A7 level indeed.
On the other hand, there is no information, that hull armour is to be modified, so it should stay on 2A4 level.

Fire control system is not to be upgraded in any substantial way, apart from newer and better TI cameras (which don't affect FC directly, I guess). (article in Polish: http://www.altair.com.pl/e-report/view?article_id=820). I think that FC should be max 50 (2A5 has 45, German early 2A6 has 50).

New ammo DM53 is expected to be used (I hope, that the politicians won't decide, that they have a modernized tank, so they could save on ammo...). Therefore it should have better gun, than others. It should be given also some HE ammo (DM11).

An icon might need to be changed in a future, because a turret shape is different, but there are no good upper views as for now. I thought Turkish 7527 could do, but it has an extra side hull armour (and a longer barrel - but should it?... ).

The best kind of upper views are here: http://www.nowastrategia.org.pl/demo...o-leopard-2pl/

A photo is 2A5 now. There are photos of a prototype only as for now, most interesting is: http://zbiam.pl/artyku%C5%82y/pierws...u-leopard-2pl/

Of course, apart from Leo 2PL, there should be regular Leopard 2A5 available since mid-2014.

Re: Poland OOB
 

There appeared some more information about PT-91 Twardy tanks, basically confirming my analysis from this thread http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showt...t=48222&page=2 , but some things might be improved.

In a meantime, there were first of all articles in Poligon 3/2013 and Nowa Technika Wojskowa (nTW) 9/2015, and a deep analysis of Erawa ERA, made by author of the latter article: http://dziennikzbrojny.pl/artykuly/a...eaktywne-erawa (in Polish)

Now we have:

010 PT-91 Twardy (1/95-12/95) - first model without TI (#129 gun D81T 75, sabot 43)

There was an information in nTW 11/1995, that the first series tanks delivered in 1995 were fitted with TI as well, but on the other hand, some articles say in general about tanks with TI and with passive night vision only (without details as for numbers or dates, though). Prototypes had no TI, but it might have been bought in time for production machines... I'd tend to fit this tank with TI (a difference between unit 018 would still be radio code).

018 PT-91 Twardy (1/96-12/98) - basic model with TI.

021 PT-91 Twardy (1/99-125) - #161 PO-99 gun (sabot 54) - because of a small quantity of Pronit sabot rounds available, it should have only a couple of sabot rounds (say 4), and the rest - regular AP (which exist in #161 gun, and has a penetration 43, like sabot of #129 gun)

711 PT-91MA1 (1/99-125) - strange variant with weaker armour, PO-99 gun, better stabilizer, 3 top ERA - apparently added after my changes (...unless I overlooked it when I researched Polish OOB in 2012).

The last tank is wrong and I don't know what it represents - it has weaker basic armour than other PT-91, and even T-72M1. All of these should have the same armour. Neither the stabiliser has been improved (not counting a stabiliser diagnostic system fitted in all PT-91, which rather does not improve it lousy work). PT-91MA1 is an official designation of T-72s modernized to PT-91 standard, but it is never used in practice, and all are just referred to as PT-91, without much practical differences (BTW designations are rather contradictory in available articles). So it should be replaced with something else.

Conclusions:

All PT-91 should have ERA top armour (at least 5) - almost 50% of upper surface is covered with ERA, and more tightly fitted, than in Soviet tanks (https://www.the-blueprints.com/bluep...-p/pt-91-2.png)

Survivability of all tanks might be improved over T-72M1 (5 instead of 4), due to new Deugra firefighting system (Russian T-90 has 5).

Instead of 4 SD and 2 VIRSS it would be better to change to 3 SD, 3 VIRSS (the tanks have 12 SD tubes and 12 VIRSS tubes).

There was finally published an information, that part of Erawa-1 ERA was replaced with Erawa-2, made of two layers of explosive, two thin armoured steel sheets and a ceramic tile. It was revealed, that during tests it decreased efficiency of early APFSDS, like Russian 3BM15, by around 57%, and even in one case prevented German DM33A1 from penetrating a front plate. Maybe it should be treated as advanced ERA then?... It is not as effective against modern long core APFSDS, but it has been suggested, that their efficiency would be lowered by 7-10%. ERAWA-2 is mounted on hull front and turret front and sides. There are no dates given, but most probably it was connected with a new configuration of turret ERA (on vertical strips with 3 blocks instead of individual blocks), introduced between 1996 and 9/1997 (when I've first seen such tank on MSPO defence industry exhibition ;).

So, I suggest to introduce a new model with advanced ERA on front and turret sides, basing upon unit #018, available from some 6/97 to 125 (it might replace unit #711). A photo should be 32261 from unit 021, with new ERA strips (photo 29495 of unit 711 shows early tank).
Also, unit #021 with Pronit sabot could have its armour upgraded.

There's a hope, that PT-91s will eventually be modernized by 2020 (in a way suggested in numerous articles from 1998 to 2015...), following Leo 2 modernization. We could add such tank now, with better ammo (500-600 RHA), good stabilizer and improved gun accuracy (thanks to new Slovak or Ukrainian gun models)*. I understand that you don't like future tanks (and I don't like either), but I guess, that with such modest expectations, and a modernization plans closing to reality, it won't be too much wishful thinking.

------
* BTW: according to a quoted article in nTW 9/2015, 2A46 gun mounted in T-72 up to Russian model A/M1 (and in other older tanks) had mediocre accuracy, due to bigger backlash and asymmetric recuperators. Its accuracy was much improved in 2A46M model, mounted in T-72B, newer variants of T-80, T-90 and yet better 2A46M-5 mounted in T-72B3. All 125mm guns in the Russian OOB have accuracy 13, apart from the gun from Armata tank...

Re: Poland OOB
 

If you ( or anyone else ) is going to make suggestions for OOB changes you better make sure you understand how the game works in regard to that change and in this case you clearly do not. There is NO code that gives 3 VIRSS and you should have checked that before posting

Re: Poland OOB
 

Sorry, Don. :doh:

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just to mention, for like 3 years now Poland has its 5th main military component, which is Territorial Force (Wojska Obrony Terytorialnej). They resemble danish Hemsvaern.

I believe it is roughly the time to include them in the OOBs? Also it should be mentioned that they use - as standard rifle - the Radom MSBS Grot AR that is also in early stage of implementation in standard Polish Army. It closely resembles ACR Bushmaster and probably be quialified for starts roughly as CZ Bren.

So far there are variations of company structures, but they should operate in three platoons, three sections each, and with 12 men in each section, including PK/UKM machinegun. RPG-7s are also available, however I am not sure if in every section.
However, WOT has or will have its own logistical system and it is aquiring weapons as independent buyer, thus they do not receive army stocks.
For this reason, starting with late 2021 first Javelins should be avilable for WOT, just as should be Spikes.
What I recomment is adding those types of formations:
WOT Company (on foot)
WOT Company (Mot) - on standard medium trucks, 2-3 per platoon (WOT will not operate heavier gear)
WOT ATGM Platoon (it can accompany the company, too) - with 3 Javelin or Spike missiles

Typical armament should be: MSBS Grot AR, UKM-2000, GNPO launcher and RPG-7. Typical section size of 12 men, probably qualified as Reserve Infantry and/or Guards Infantry.
WOT is being motivated on historical and quasi political grounds, I recomment it to have -5 for EXP (weekend soldiers after all but trained by professionals) but +5 to morale given their very function.

Could it be done?

Re: Poland OOB
 

I suppose we could but are they significantly different in organization from a standard rifle company or platoon?

Re: Poland OOB
 

They do - bigger sections (12 so far compared to ~6 nominally, there is no Polish "rifle" section per se as no unit except WOT is footmobile), diffent support weapons, different main service rifle... well, National Guard gets own formations even though differences are little. Scandinavian territorial force is also added for a long time. WOT already has about 25 thousand troops with 54 thousand to be there by 2023.

Re: Poland OOB
 

Build the units if need be and put them in formations then post it here and I will check them over and try to get it in. That's the simplest way. Save it as OB 98

Re: Poland OOB
 

Here is what I found about WOT (Wojska Obrony Terytorialnej)

That's true they are 4th military component after Ground Forces&Navy&Air force

Schematic of base unit

https://www.defence24.pl/cache/img/1...3cf4e5d8f9.jpg

Their official webpage google translated to English
https://translate.google.com/transla...l%2F&sandbox=1

Presentation from WOT about their structure and tasks. in Slide 11 is a Structure of WOT Light infantry company
https://slideplayer.pl/slide/13775754/

https://i.imgur.com/v2yETJM.png

Here twitter about their MSBS Grot AR https://twitter.com/terytorialsi/sta...74095996375040

As is possible to see on that https://i.iplsc.com/star-266m2-po-mo...14-C122-F4.jpgphoto their main Truck is STAR-266M2 deep modernisation and rebuilding of original STAR266 from 1970
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_266M

They also receive new trucks Jelcz 442.32 "Bartek" introduced to army in 2013 they buy especially 500 just for WOT in 2017 https://www.defence24.pl/mon-kupuje-...t-aktualizacja
Here is nice model of this truck https://pwm.org.pl/viewtopic.php?p=1030098
http://www.truck-spotters.eu/attachm...d6c8eb99b00e0e

https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jelcz_442.32

And here in polish wikipedia is list of all weapons of WOT
https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wojska..._Terytorialnej

They have also LMP-2017 new mortar 60mm itroduced in 2019
https://www.milmag.pl/news/view?news_id=4111

https://pliki.wnp.pl/d/38/08/62/380862_r2_940.jpg

https://www.radiomaryja.pl/informacj...erza-lmp-2017/
And better photos of new mortar http://www.polska-zbrojna.pl/home/ar...rz-dla-WOT-u-#

Re: Poland OOB
 

Trucks can simply be medium/light trucks - SP games seem not to differenciate trucks too much, which is also obviously a good choice.
What you posted is old structure from 2017 - it it still changing, even now, thus I consider it MOST LIKELY that still 12 men sections are being upheld. I would however not rely on this too much, before posting my request and I did some intel. I found nothing that can give 100% confirmed status, my friend who is serving there is away at this point, it will probably be the easiest to ask him :P
Sidenote: WOT is 5th branch, Army Special Forces are the 4th :P

Re: Poland OOB
 

Błażej..... the simplest thing is YOU build the units and formations in an R+D folder and I will integrate them into the OOB. I have little enthusiasm for wading though translated information and then putting my interpretation on it only to find out I was wrong.

For example. That platoon *seems* to suggest at least 2 of the 12 members are sapper/engineers which IS unusual and would make for a unique platoon but I will leave that up to you and when you are done if I have any questions I will contact you

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just 2 engineers in a platoon would not be worth bothering with a separate game engineer class element either, really.

Re: Poland OOB
 

No but a 10 man Rifle Squad + a 2 man Sapper section could be for example four 10 man rifle sections and four 2 man sapper/engineers sections

OR

four 10 man rifle sections and one 8 man sapper/engineers section to make up the platoon. The smaller unit makes them more vulnerable but more flexible in deployment

I will wait for whatever Błażej comes up with then adjust to suit the game if necessary

Re: Poland OOB
 

The other issue that needs to be considered is the number of slots available in formations.

Sometimes you find you have to cut or combine small units (i.e. two MG teams combined into a 2-gun section) or something similar.

3x 10-man rifle squads + 3x 2-man sapper sections is 6 of the 10 available slots, this only leaves 4 for MGs or AT weapons or whatever.

Re: Poland OOB
 

This concept with medic and engineer in each squad is long dropped, that I can confirm

Re: Poland OOB
 

Done

Hope that will be accurate propostion. I made asssumption that in first year 2017 WOT uses old AKM what is visible on photos. Then in 2018 start to adopt 5.56mm MSBS Grot AR but process of conversion take propably around one year. So after 2019 they are only with new rifles. Next assumption is that UKM-2000 is in every Sec. Also unique weapons which they have is 60mm LMP-2017 Moratar introduced in December 2019. That is why I think that they may have something like Moratar unit and also use them for support Plt together with RPG-7. I made other assumption that training sappers take some time so this units apear after 2018 isn't necessary to create Sappers with AKM. Now their main AT weapon is RPG-7 that is why I include RPG-7 team just from 2018. They may have small number of Spikes during waiting when Javelin's will be itroduced posible that somwhere in next year 2022. Sniper is just from normal units meby is not necessary create a speciall WOT sniper unit. I also added Jelcz 442.32 Bartek which is used by normal army but also WOT so that is why starts in 2014 the same with Ford Ranger which is designed as a sucessor of standard utility car Tarpan Honker in regular units. Quads are also used by regular army.

https://i.imgur.com/LkaoPBf.png
I used free slots for new units formations and weapons so will be easy copy this to polish OOB without changings postions. There is also [obat002 WOT inside polish OOB.zip] where you can test how this units fit inside polish OOB already included. There inside Polish OOB exists formation Mech Militia Pl slot 390 which represents OTK [Obrona terytorialna Kraju] During Polish People Republic that was an militia army moustly disolved in 1989 but last units after many reforms lasts until 2008 when army was fully profesionalised and such secound line forces were disolved. So I propose to short this formation to 2008 then is gap until 2017 and WOT were again created as a answer to this what happens in Ukraine in 2014.

Re: Poland OOB
 

OK thanks. I will take a look at all this tomorrow

Re: Poland OOB
 

All in now. The only change I made was to the unitclass of the AT teams. Now UC212.

Thanks.

Don

Re: Poland OOB
 

Thank you!
And thanks for doing that, I have never made an OOB and I am not super keen to play with it :V

Re: Poland OOB
 

Poland after WW2 never has a big enough aircraft industry to build their own military fighters or bombers aircraft's but rather was an license builder for aircraft's and helicopters which Soviet Union consider esential but not the high-tech at the times and need them manufature somwhere but not delay manufacturing of more esential aircraft's. Except this license production in Poland were designed some jet trainers like in Czechoslovakia. We lost competition for Jet Trainer for whole Warsaw Pact which became Aero L-29 Delfin but Poland became only country in bloc which have their own trainer TS-11 Iskra.

There is also icon of of ill fated I-22 Iryda which were own equivalent of AlphaJet. And TS-16 Grot which was an supersonic trainer. Program closed by soviet commrades because propably only a trainer with some stirke cability but to close to manufacturing serious fighter-bombers.
https://www.globalsecurity.org/milit.../pzl-ts-16.htm

https://i.imgur.com/ZRP9gga.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/wWepimO.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/saQ34KW.png


I will upload this in a while together with shp file and some propsition for OOB

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just FYI I am not interested in "what-if" projects or training aircraft for MBT so feel free to post it but I'm not interested for the master game unless they were actually used by active units

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just d'like to add description what are WOT units and why the were created for game if you retain slots files are named correctly. In every txt file is the same text.

Re: Poland OOB
 

Hope that this will be usefully I made a lot of new icons for aircrafts Su-17/20/22 to cover swep wings ability like in F-14 for attack with two different speeds. Yak-11 because is direct descadent of Yak piston fighters meaby used for training but also usefully as coin aircraft. Iryda,Bies,Grot mentioned earlier polish coin aircrafts. Whole familly of Yak-12& Wilga AOP so no more Cesna and Piper Cub capitalistic icons in Warsaw Pact country's. Orlik is also there modern polish light trainer and COIN atacker. When I repainted Alenia Aermacchi M-346 I found thatYak-130 is exactly the same aircraft with slight differences so he was also redone with corect camo's. And best is on the end Agricultural machinery pesant's aircraft's Kruk, Dromader & Belphengor to be used in forgoten wars as fly technicals. You may laught from this slow rural aircraft's but as I read they have secound darker usage than cropsdusting which is not covered by game. Agricultural aircraft were intended to be used as a doomsday devices in case of full total Word War. Simple in the same way like pesticites the can spray poisonous chemicals
and deadly plages from military labs. In Poland are rumor's that in 1970's M-15 Belphengor which was radiculus from economical point of view (jet cropduster) was build with this secound role in mind as [Ultima ratio regum]

I also add OOb with covers export of Polish (Mig) Lim to different coutry's. Usage of An-2 (which is also agricutural) in different fogotten wars from vietnam to Bosnia. As ersatz bomber
but also as simple Gunship. Here I also d'like to propose Po-2 with one gun as primitive gunship. I read many stories that during fight with post AK underground in Poland Po-2 was used to spot and attack them continosly so I supouse that this was typical usage in internal wars in Estern Europe and Asia especially against week oppostion and internal enemies of comunistic states. Propably this role meaby after 1960 was taken by An-2 proposed in this oob also as erzatz gunship. There is also M346 for Poland and Israel and Mi6 which I know was only in small number in Poland exactly 3 pices but will be nice to have hevy helicopter I found great photo of this helicopter. There is also TS-11 Iskra icons alredy in game which was a trainer but also basic coin attacker with different variants of weapons for Poland and India. Iryda iskra replacemnt which wasn't only prototype but in small number was in use in 90's in polish army and also orlik which is trainer but also small coin attacker in three variants, also all variants of Yak-12 AOP I know there is no space for this small aircrafts in rusian OOB but may fit to Red OOB to represets their evolution of utility aviation. Cropdusters if you found them usefully may find thir way to red or green OOB to represents this makeshift bombers used on small wars.


// Icon0191.shp - H
{19100, -1}, //8482 Su-17M2/20/22 wings in fast flight postion (silver)
{19101, -1}, //8483 Su-17M2/20/22 wings in slow flight postion (silver)
{19102, -1}, //8484 Su-17 soviet wings in fast flight postion (silver)
{19103, -1}, //8485 Su-17 soviet wings in fast flight postion (green-brown-sand camo)
{19104, -1}, //8486 Su-17M2 SEAD with Kh-25 soviet wings in slow flight postion with (green-brown-sand camo)
{19105, -1}, //8487 Su-17M2 SEAD with Kh-25 soviet wings in fast flight postion with (green-brown-sand camo)
{19106, -1}, //8488 Su-17M2 bombs soviet wings in fast flight postion (green-brown-sand camo)
{19107, -1}, //8489 Su-22 unguided rockets wings in slow flight postion (green-black-red brick camo)
{19108, -1}, //8490 Su-22 SEAD with Kh-25 rockets wings in fast flight postion with (green-black-red brick camo)
{19109, -1}, //8491 Su-22 bombs wings in slow flight postion (green-brown-red brick camo)
{19110, -1}, //8492 Su-22 SEAD with Kh-25 rockets bombs wings in fast flight postion (green-brown-red brick camo)
{19111, -1}, //8493 Su-22 SEAD with Kh-25 rockets wings in slow flight postion (green-brown-desert camo)
{19112, -1}, //8494 Su-22 with bombs wings in fast flight postion (green-brown-desert camo)
{19113, -1}, //8495 Su-22 Czechoslovakia with bombs wings in slow flight postion (green-brown camo)
{19114, -1}, //8496 Su-22 Czechoslovakia SEAD with Kh-25 rockets wings in slow flight postion (green-brown camo)
{19115, -1}, //8497 Su-22 Czechoslovakia SEAD with Kh-25 rockets wings in fast flight postion (green-brown camo)
{19116, -1}, //8498 Su-22 DDR with bombs wings in fast flight postion (green-brown-sand camo)
{19117, -1}, //8499 Su-22 Luftwaffe after german unification in slow flight postion (green-brown-sand camo)
{19118, -1}, //8500 Su-22 Poland after 2012 SEAD with Kh-25 rockets wings in slow flight postion (greay-blue-gray camo)
{19119, -1}, //8501 Su-22 Poland after 2012 with bombs wings in fast flight postion (greay-blue-gray camo)
{19120, -1}, //8502 Yak-11 (silver)
{19121, -1}, //8503 Yak-11 (green)
{19122, -1}, //8504 Yak-11 (desert)
{19123, -1}, //8505 Yak-11 (desert-brown)
{19124, -1}, //8506 Yak-11 Soviet (silver)
{19125, -1}, //8507 Yak-11 Soviet (green)
{19126, -1}, //8508 Yak-11 North-Korea (silver)
{19127, -1}, //8509 Yak-11 North-Korea improvised ground atack (green)
{19128, -1}, //8510 Yak-11 Polish (silver)
{19129, -1}, //8511 Yak-11 North-Vietnam (green)
{19130, -1}, //8512 Yak-11 China PRC (silver)
{19131, -1}, //8513 Yak-11 Czechoslovakia (silver)
{19132, -1}, //8514 Yak-11 Eastern Germany DDR (silver)
{19133, -1}, //8515 Yak-11 Austria (silver)
{19134, -1}, //8516 Yak-11 Algeria (desert)
{19135, -1}, //8517 Yak-11 Egypt (silver)
{19136, -1}, //8518 Yak-11 Egypt (desert-brown)
{19137, -1}, //8519 Yak-11 Yemen (desert-green)
{19138, -1}, //8520 PZL I-22 Iryda Polish (grey)
{19139, -1}, //8521 PZL I-22 Iryda Polish (grey-green-desert camo)
{19140, -1}, //8522 TS-8 Bies Polish (silver)
{19141, -1}, //8523 TS-8 Bies Indonesia (silver)
{19142, -1}, //8524 TS-16A Grot (polish x-plane from 60's hypersonic fighter-bomber)
{19143, -1}, //8525 TS-16B Grot (polish x-plane from 60's hypersonic trainer-fighter bomber)
{19144, -1}, //8526 LWD Junak (green)
{19145, -1}, //8527 Yak-10 soviet (green)
{19146, -1}, //8528 Yak-12 (green)
{19147, -1}, //8529 Yak-12 (desert)
{19148, -1}, //8530 Yak-12 (silver)
{19149, -1}, //8531 Yak-12 soviet (green)
{19150, -1}, //8532 Shenyang type 5 [licensed Yak-12] China PRC (green)
{19151, -1}, //8533 Yak-12A (silver)
{19152, -1}, //8534 Yak-12A (green)
{19153, -1}, //8535 Yak-12A (desert)
{19154, -1}, //8536 Yak-12M (green)
{19155, -1}, //8537 Yak-12M (desert)
{19156, -1}, //8538 Yak-12M (silver)
{19157, -1}, //8539 Yak-12M soviet (green)
{19158, -1}, //8540 PZL-101 Gawron (green)
{19159, -1}, //8541 PZL-101 Gawron (desert)
{19160, -1}, //8542 PZL-104 Wilga (green)
{19161, -1}, //8543 PZL-104 Wilga (desert)
{19162, -1}, //8544 PZL-104 Wilga (silver)
{19163, -1}, //8545 PZL-104 Wilga (green-white winter)
{19164, -1}, //8546 PZL-104 Wilga (green-dark green camo Polish)
{19165, -1}, //8547 PZL-104 Wilga (grey Polish)
{19166, -1}, //8548 PZL-104 Gelatik (jungle camo Indonesia license build)
{19167, -1}, //8549 PZL-104 Wilga (desert-green Egypt)
{19168, -1}, //8550 PZL-104 Wilga (grey-green Yugoslavia before civil war)
{19169, -1}, //8551 PZL-104 Wilga (green-dark brown-sand Republika Srpska Air Force of the fraction in Bosnian civil war)
{19170, -1}, //8552 PZL-104 Wilga (Hungary Peoples Republic)
{19171, -1}, //8553 PZL-104 Wilga (Polish Border Guard)
{19172, -1}, //8554 PZL-104 Wilga (Estonian)
{19173, -1}, //8555 PZL-104 Wilga (Latvian)
{19174, -1}, //8556 PZL-104 Wilga (Lithuanian)
{19175, -1}, //8557 PZL-104 Wilga (Moldova)
{19176, -1}, //8558 PZL-130 Orlik
{19177, -1}, //8559 PZL-130TB Orlik (Polish gray before 2012)
{19178, -1}, //8560 PZL-130TC Orlik (Polish gray after 2012)
{19179, -1}, //8561 PZL-130TC-2 Orlik (Polish gray-light gray)
{19180, -1}, //8562 Alenia Aermacchi M-346
{19181, -1}, //8563 Alenia Aermacchi M-346 (Italy)
{19182, -1}, //8564 Alenia Aermacchi M-346 Lavi (Israel)
{19183, -1}, //8565 Alenia Aermacchi M-346 Bielik (Poland)
{19184, -1}, //8566 Yak-130 (dark grey)
{19185, -1}, //8567 Yak-130 (green)
{19186, -1}, //8568 Yak-130 (desert)
{19187, -1}, //8569 Yak-130 (Rusian gray-blue-dark blue camo)
{19188, -1}, //8570 Yak-130 (Algerian desert-brown camo)
{19189, -1}, //8571 Yak-130 (Belorusian green-dark green-grey camo)
{19190, -1}, //8572 Yak-130 (Laos green-desert-bright green camo)
{19191, -1}, //8573 Yak-130 (Bangladesh grey-dark grey camo)
{19192, -1}, //8574 PZL-106 Kruk (agritractor livery)
{19193, -1}, //8575 PZL-106 Turbo Kruk (agritractor livery)
{19194, -1}, //8576 PZL M-18 Dromader (agritractor livery)
{19195, -1}, //8577 PZL M-18 Dromader (sand-brown-green Croatia ersatz bomber war in yougoslavia)
{19196, -1}, //8578 PZL M-15 Belphengor (agritractor green camo)
{19197, -1}, //8579 PZL-230 Skorpion (polish x-plane from 90's cheap small battle support plane)

Re: Poland OOB
 

There are photos of Leopard 2PL on their first field deploy by army on Training Ground in Orzysz Feb 2021 in nice winter Camo. Is possible that this is actually an standard winter painting for all polish tanks.

https://www.defence24.pl/upload/2021...eopard2pl8.jpg
https://radioolsztyn.pl/wp-content/u...5-1320x744.jpg

More photos
https://www.defence24.pl/leopardy-2p...w-orzyszu-foto
https://radioolsztyn.pl/leopardy-na-...ojowy/01555752


And here polish tanks from WW2 t-34 on Pomerania Wall 1945 and Topas 50's/60's use quite similar pattern so not so many changes since WW2

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/nK...s=w481-h553-no

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just do like to mention that Javelin ver.F was today [17 June 2021] first time used by WOT on proving ground. Poland ordered FGM-148F JAVELIN in number of 180 launchers for WOT.

Here article and also photo of WOT soldiers with Javelin :D
https://translate.google.com/transla...terytorialnej/

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just prepared new icon for Krab

But I must explain long story of AHS Krab self-propelled artillery

Firs polish government buy license for build AS-90 towers from UK in 1999 then "Huta Stalowa Wola" build UPG-NG chassis for that tower in 2001. UPG-NG is build on modified SUM-Kalina minelayer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SPG_Kalina In 2001 first prototype was build and until 2011 three prototypes were build only. Around 2010 BAE Systems stop to build Gun barrels for AS90 so for next series 8 vehicles build in 2011 French Nexter 52 155mm guns were chosen. In 2014-2016 16 vehicles were build and barrels were again changed this time to Rhainmetal build on license in HSW. In 2015 because problems with UPG-NG chasis cracks. Chassis from South Korean K9 Thunder were chosen and since then full scale production starts with K9PL chassis build in Poland and that is now main version of Krab 155mmm. So as you see Krab is like a military Lego set tower from UK chasis domestic then from South Korea and gun British then French then German and Polish equipmment inside etc.

Early small scale production chassis UPG-NG Krab after 2016 this earlier variant chassis were scraped and towers put on K9 so became K9PL
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ASH_Krab_1.jpg

K9PL Krab variant build after 2016 with Rheinmetal 155mm gun now main production variant of Krab
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...9D_%285%29.JPG


As for now OOB represent this small scale production UPG-NG and icon also
which only 16 were build. So I d'like propose after 2016 this new version K9PL Krab which is now build 72 vehicles and full contract is for 120
Here icon for this new version
https://forum.shrapnelgames.com/atta...1&d=1628108908

Re: Poland OOB
 

Just on the beginning of this Year Leopard 2PL was introduced into units and start to be used. But Polish industry prepared new modernized variant called Leopard 2PLM1
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ZqSUZXY29...40-h480/13.jpg

here what is modernised according to this source https://thedeaddistrict.blogspot.com...e-leopard.html

Re: Poland OOB
 

ZU-23-2 AA guns

An issue of ZU-23-3 gun mutations is vague, because Polish Army doesn't bother to inform citizens which versions and with what sights they use, but for Wikipedia purpose I researched the subject from several articles in military press about sights development for these guns.

088 ZU-23-2 AA-Gun (basic Soviet variant FC=5) - Poland didn't buy a license to manufacture ZAP-23 opto-mechanical vector sights, only basic optical sights, so it might have had worse FC, than Soviet version (now all have 5). On the other hand, maybe ZU-23-2 guns with ZAP-23 sights should have better FC, than weak 5? (worse than WWII 37mm gun or 40mm Bofors, which have 10)..
Here's Bulgarian manufacturer's description: https://arconpartners.net/anti-aircr...-sight-zap-23/

I don't know however (and maybe nobody knows) how rich were versions sold to numerous African or Asian countries - while we can assume, that Warsaw Pact (except for Poland) had standard ZAP-23 sights, which is mentioned in Russian publications as standard equipment. Poland wanted to develop own sights instead - what took 20 years...


79 ZUR-23-2S Jod (Polish ZU-23 combined with Strela missiles and new sights GP-1R of 1988, FC=15) - vision should be 0 (15), just like basic ZU-23 (no night sights at all).

619 ZU-23-2E (improved AA gun with new CKE-1 sights of 2002, FC=20) - name should be ZU-23-2K in fact (E was a proposal with central battery fire control, while K have new individual collimator sights).
Now it has vision 40, while it should have 0 from the start, and 30 only from 2004 (CKE-1N sights with passive night vision). Vision 40 was obtained only in 2016 (CKE-1T sights with TI). These versions might be added.

Icon should be 1979 (ordinary ZU-23, without missiles)

BTW: thanks to CKE sights and new Polish APDS ammo, efficient range grew to 5500 m, but I don't know if it matters.


95 ZUR23-2KG Jodek (Polish ZU-23 with Grom missiles of 2002) - FC should be 20 (now 15), like unit 619 of the same year with the same family sights CKE-2 (it can engage targets flying 500 m/s, comparing to 300 m/s in case of ZAP-23).
Vision should be 0, and 30 only from 2004 (CKE-2N sights, as above)

169 ZUR23-2KG Jodek - it might represent version with more advanced CP-1 sights with laser RF, but it has no TI, only passive night channel (now: vision 40).
It was introduced in 2007 (or more safely: 2008) (now: 106).

I would suggest to improve FC to 25 (now 20) - CP-1 programmable sights are told to be big improvement, able to fight guided bombs and drones.

Re: Poland OOB
 

SAMs and MANPADS


85 Aster 30 - well, seems that for 5 years we should already have Aster SAM... of course there aren't any and there are no such plans anymore.

611 Loara SP-SAM - with Crotale - pure fiction


201 Grom Team - basic version was delivered from 2002 according to newest publications (now 101).
Picture is Strela - photos are eg. https://wml.wat.edu.pl/index.php/his...rgrom-zkr.html , https://www.mesko.com.pl/zestawy-prz...wlotnicze.html

205 Grom Team - initial version, ending date should be extended at least until 2001 (see above), or rather until some 2005. Better name is Grom-I Team to differentiate from Grom. Picture is Strela

weapon #126 Grom-I SAM - kill statistisc should be the same as #127 Grom - there is no information, that the warhead changed (now they are like old Strela-2). On the other hand, it seems, that warhead size of both should be 4, not 5, like Igla and most MANPADS (it has 1.27 kg - French Mistral with warhead 5 has 2,95 kg).
Accuracy probably should be lower - homing head was basing upon Russian export (simpler) Igla, so it should probably be 118 at best (like basic Russian Igla), maybe even 110-115 (now 120).
In #127 Grom the homing head was much improved by the Polish and it is 130 (justified).

The weapon is also used by Georgia (the same issue with Strela picture, unit 351 Grom SAM)

There appeared recently new modern Piorun SAM - a development of Grom (formerly Grom-M), delivered from 2019. It is said, that accuracy and target detection have been much improved, to world's best level - although Grom has already accuracy 130, and I don't know if any MANPADS in the game is better than 130. Range was enhanced to 400-6500 m. The launcher is fitted with TI sights.


612 Poprad, 614 Zubr P - it is the same Poprad SAM system in fact, but 612 is prototype on Iveco truck, and 614 is final vehicle on ligtly armoured Zubr chassis, and it is the only one that should be taken into account - with Poprad name. However, icon 76 of 612 Poprad is better.
Two vehicles of trial series (on Zubr chassis) were tested by the Army in 2014, but series vehicled were commissioned only from 2018.
One vehicle should be armed with #126 Grom (not Grom-I), and another with Piorun SAM, first fired from 2020. There are 8 missiles carried.
There should be no machine gun, especially ancient DsHK.
It has TI head and laser RF. But it can't swim.
The launcher itself is not armoured, so maybe it should not have armour all around.
Size 3 would be more appropriate for mid-size truck (now 2) (same for unit 726 Zubr scout vehicle)


BTW, from 11/07 Indonesia uses a small number of Poprad systems with Grom missiles on unarmoured 6x6 Land Rover chassis, and ZUR23-2KG-I AA guns, also with Groms (Polish 169) - https://www.armyrecognition.com/indo...sh_poland.html

Polish export name is Kobra, reportedly they are named Aster in Indonesia, but I can't confirm it. As far as I know, only 8 vehicles were delivered in two batches by 2010.

Re: Poland OOB
 

Here best photos of Żubr MRAP vehicle which I found on AMZ Kutno official page ZubrP is AA version http://amz.pl/pojazdy-wojskowe/opancerzone/zubr-p/

And here only drawings of this vehicle found primitive but best what we have

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...050a495d_c.jpg

Re: Poland OOB
 

Re: Poland OOB
 

So according to AMZ Kutno website and wikipedia https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMZ_%C5%BBubr they are now two versions

and also this article https://milmag.pl/mspo-2021-system-o...od-pit-radwar/

Żubr P Poprad (AA version)
- with Grom rockets (older variant)
- new Piorun AA rockets (new production vehicles)
Don't know if all were modernised all two version existing together probably this second and all will be modernised to Piorun when older rockets will be used
- variant with radar Soła & Bystra
- WG-35 FOO vehicle for battery of Poprad

Żubr WD (command variant)

Żubr MMSR (with radio-location device N-26A/MMSR)

Here how Poprad unit my looks like in organisation
https://milmag.pl/2021/wp-content/up...1-1340x804.jpg

Re: Poland OOB
 

Misc.

66 Heavy Truck - typical US truck picture, strange-looking for Poland, should be replaced eg. with 29168 (Zil-131) or better 29388 (modern Polish Jelcz)

77 HMMWV Trynka AT - there are no variants with Spike and 12.7mm MG. There are used M1045 with Spike only, named Tumak-5, not Trynka https://modelwork.pl/topic/11777-hmm...ojsku-polskim/
Possibly uncovered 98 UKM-2000 CMG could be mounted in need, although there is no such mention...

580, 583 HMMWV Trynka - Trynka was only proposed 12.7mm MG variant. It should be renamed Tumak with 98 UKM-2000 CMG

921 HMMWV [utility vehicle] - utility variant is not armed (especially old SGM MG is not used).


158,159,951 F-16c Jastrzab - F-16C Jastrzab would be better and consistent.


191 Hibneryt-P SPAA - its ZU-23-2 gun should be updated according to 619 ZU-23-2E(K) standard (FC=20, RF=10), with night vision. Used already from around 10/07 (now 1/08)

Ordinary unarmoured 200 Hibneryt also used better ZU-23-2K guns when they were available, but I think that Hibneryt-P would be enough.

581 Irbis - not accepted, sole prototype.


545 Light Truck - picture looks strange for Poland. In fact there were no 4x4 light trucks for 12 men used in Poland (only jeeps or medium trucks). Anyway, since it is used among others to tow Vasilek mortars in the game, the photo could be changed to GAZ-66 32174, used in a small number, and made available from 1/84.


584 Dzik 2 - (class Gun APC Wheeled) - it isn't used in infantry recce units, but exclusively as APC for Military Gendarmerie Special Units (Oddziały Specjalne Żandarmerii Wojskowej), created around the same time. Carry capacity is up to 8. Better photo with ZW markings might be Pm29528. It seems they were used only until around 2015. Nicknamed Dzik-2 'Gucio'. Could be class 23 APC Wheel, which is free in this period.

There could be created such special unit (class Police?), named eg. OS ZW Squad or SpecZW Squad (or section). They were used among others in some peacekeeping duties in Africa. I guess the squad should be around 6 men, armament is mostly #026 wz.96 Beryl SMG and MP-5. I don't know if LMGs are used as a standard.
Photos are eg https://d-art.ppstatic.pl/kadry/k/r/...6b_o_large.jpg https://zbrojni.blob.core.windows.ne...2/Images/18756
https://zoom.mon.gov.pl/static/zdjecia/IMG_8026.jpg
https://static.polityka.pl/_resource...319e_f1400x900
Picture 29238 of Grom special unit could fit eventually

From 2016 they use Plasan SandCat, named Szop in Poland (carry 8) https://www.defence24.pl/plasan-sand...erii-wojskowej

Also heavy M1151 HMMWV with FRAG armour were used by OS ZW from 2009, with UKM-2000 CMG.
https://modelwork.pl/topic/11777-hmm...ojsku-polskim/

Such HMMWV with FRAG kit were also used as a scout vehicle in Iraq, but I don't know since when (some 2007?)


699 GAZ-46 MAW - SMG MG was never mounted upon GAZ-46, in any country. It had no mountings for any MG.

703 BAV-485 6x6 - as a rule it wasn't armed (there could be the second entry). Polish name was BAW (number wasn't used, and 6x6 is redundant) (btw, number is redundant also in other countries, because its Russian army name was BAV, and factory name ZiL-485)


723 Tarpan Rys - in fact Honker Rys - it was experimental proposal of armed utility car with very limited use in Poland. It's better to replace it with Honker Skorpion, keeping the same similar picture - used in Iraq from 10/04, lightly armoured (sides, maybe lower front, gunner's front), armed with 98 UKM-2000 CMG

726 Zubr - not accepted yet as a scout vehicle. Command vehicle Zubr-WD has been proposed for several years, but I don't know how is its status - few are used at best, and rather unarmed. May be preserved for future use.

752 ODS-LST (landing ship) - armament was #96 30 mm gun, not 14.5mm MG.

843 BTR-60PB - in Poland they were not numerous, and used only by the Police - in case of mobilization they could be used by the Police (#178 class). It concerns only formation 390. They would not be used by the army, especially contemporary WOT light infantry. Only few survived in police service by now.

920 Tarpan Honker [utility vehicle] - name should be just Honker. Picture is Mercedes - could be 29331, 29380, 29386.
It should not be armed apart from special patrol vehicles (see Skorpion above).

--
From 2005 there was adopted 12.7mm Tor sniper rifle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WKW_Wilk

That's all as for now.

Re: Poland OOB
 

Pibwl mentioned about about different variants of HMMWV in Polish army so I made some research and forged this into proposition of add-on to Polish OOB.

So what is proposed here

I proposing put this in slots 841 to 869 they are free in spob002

Tarpan Skorpion - polish very light armoured car used as a utility and patrol car especially in Iraq after 2003 and now inside Poland
Lbms Pm29660.lbm&Pm29660.lbm

Tarpan Honker - new lbm Pm29662.lbm

PWA Aero - New polish car for paratroopers first in Polish army which can land with use of transport palette which can be throw from transport aircraft's

LPU Zmija - variant of PWA aero for ground forces used as a patrol car

GAZ-69&UAZ-469&Tarpan Honker used by paratroopers since 1960 they can't land on parachute but were indented to be delivered by helicopters or transport planes.

M-ATV -MRAP from USA in use in Poland

Cougar HEV 4x4&Cougar MRAP&MaxxPro 4x4 they were on loan in Afghanistan equipped in polish weapons used by Polish contingent there after 2014 returned to US army.

HMMWV-MMG(+) also used in Afghanistan until 2009

HMMWV Tumak in different variants used in Poland now usually by Para force but also in other ground units and special forces.

Dana M2 modernised variant of Dana which now starts to be used.

Regina AWD FO - command vehicle for Krab unit

Rosomak AWD command variant also used in Afghanistan

Rosomak MMG simplifier variant with open MG also used in Afghanistan

K9PL Krab - New variant of Krab icon proposed in previous posts

Piorun Team - with nice lbm Pm29687.lbm



Also d'like to propose aircraft's in slots 924 to 949

F-35A JSF - Poland plan to buy them in 2024
Po-2 Kukuruznik - old slow biplane used as ersatz bomber and gunship during fights with post AK underground in 1950's
Yak-11&Yak18
TS-8 Bies - first polish modern coin aircraft build in local factories used for training and in case of war as ersatz AOP and ground atack
TS-11 Iskra - polish main coin small jet used for training and in case of war as a simple fighter-bomber equivalent of L-29 Delfin in rest of Warsaw Pact
PZL I-22 Iryda - ill fated successor of Iskra
M346 Bielik - Modern coin Jet in Polish army
PZL-130 Orlik - simple modern coin aircraft all variants TB TC TC2
PZL-230 Skorpion & TS-16B Grot two most advanced prototypes for indigenous coin fighter-bomber
Mi-6 - also used in Polish army but in small number 3x

Re: Poland OOB
 

I know this is rather not important, but for a sake of precision, an autocorrection according to more detailed article:

I asked at Zandarmeria Wojskowa fb page, and a section has 8 man, currently armed with MP-5 and HK416.
Szop (SandCat) vehicles are armed with Mk 17 GL or 7.62mm minigun (some generic light MRV icon might be used, like 680 or 7718)

Re: Poland OOB
 

I've found great article about ATGM in Polish service until 1989, for the first time making wider usage of archives ("Nowa Technika Wojskowa" 2/2021) - some dates, which I tried to figure out years ago from partial sources, might be corrected:

30 BRDM Trzmiel - in 1962 there were only few launchers delivered for training, and they appeared in units from mid-63 (now 1/62). Withdrawn from service already by 12/78 (now 89) (stored until 1985, but not included in mobilization plans).

Would need a change in 082 SP-ATGM Platoon, as the first unit.

433 GAZ-69 Trzmiel - same as above, but delivered to units only in 1965. Rare vehicle, used only in airborne division.

24 BRDM-2 Malutka2 - delivered only on 1974 (now 73).
Wrong name - it's not Malutka-2, but Malutka-P (could be BRDM2 Malutka-P, just Malutka-P, or 9P133 Malutka-P)

33 BRDM Malutka (Malutka-M) - most probably only two launchers were used for training (other documents indicate 12 vehicles, but it is less reliable, and in 1971 only two are mentioned)

34 BRDM-2 Konkurs - used in units only from 1985 (now 84).
Probably withdrawn by now, but I have no precise info.

73 Fagot ATGM - appeared in units already in 1977 (now 79)

481 Para Fagot ATGM - not used by airborne forces at all at that time (I don't know how about later 490-491 units)

638 Metis Para ATGM - already withdrawn (around 2010?, after an advent of Spike)

794 WOT JavelinTeam - may be available even earlier [now 1/22] - in 6/21 first batch of operators completed training and first ones were fired.

Re: Poland OOB
 

Found interesting information

Rosomak APC without tower with small rotational MMG which I proposed earlier as a addition to Polish OOB is know in army as Rosomak M-3
https://zbiam.pl/wp-content/uploads/...8b511b1a_b.jpg They were used in Afganistan and Chad and after that returned to Poland. Here were put in storages and now are rebuild to new variant

Rosomak-S which is transporter for two Spike-LR sets. Visible is that small tower will be removed and probably many changes inside
https://zbiam.pl/wp-content/uploads/...0dc848ae_b.jpg

source about Rosomak M-3 https://zbiam.pl/wojsko-chce-kolejne-rosomaki-m-3/
source about rebuilding to Rosomak S https://zbiam.pl/przekazanie-kto-rosomak-s/

in December 2021 was mentioned that all ordered vehicles are already rebuild to version which is know by nickname "SpikeBus"
https://zbiam.pl/artykuly/nowe-rosomaki-s-juz-w-wojsku/


Here also photo of Polish airborne PWA Aero with mortar mentioned earlier which is in use by Polish paratroopers icon proposed in earlier post

https://zbiam.pl/wp-content/uploads/.../PWA-AERO1.jpg

Re: Poland OOB
 

There has been a Rosomak APC named M3 with just an MMG in the OOB's for over a decade.

Just when exactly did you "propose" it's addition??

As for the Rosomak-S.......it would be nice to know if it's just a dedicated SP-ATGM vehicle or an APC with standard CC that just happens to have two Spike launchers......

OR

is it as the other article suggest it's just a APC modified slightly to accommodate 2 Spike teams

if it has mounted launchers it's an SP-ATGM but this is a translation issue and it was designed to accommodate 2 spike teams then it's just an APC for use by 2 ATGM teams.

According to info I have found it is........

Re: Poland OOB
 

To the ROSOMAK-S yes, 2 SPIKE-LR teams.

However there just under 350 ROSOMAK armed with the Oto Melara 30 mm Hitfist-30P turret and it is my understanding those turrets will be modified to carry a 2xSPIKE-LR launcher. This was discussed as early as 2015 along with a new unmanned turret. Due to time constraints can't verify back fit status of the HITFIST turrets, unless I come across something while writing this.
https://defence24.com/rosomak-with-s...pcoming-months

The new ZSSW turret just completed testing this a remote operated turret that I gather could see production next year. I would expect TI/GSR 45 or maybe better.
https://defence24.com/armed-forces/l...test-programme
https://defence24.com/armed-forces/l...-the-specifics

Just is just overall good data...
Under Production and Variants of the next...
"...with the M3 APCs equipped with additional armor. In 2008 one Rosomak was attacked by the Taliban and thanks to its add-on armour it survived a frontal hit by a RPG-7 rocket, and fired back, the returned to base safely."
https://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/m...TO-Rosomak.php

A VERY CLOSE READING of the following paras could prove "enlightening" from the next ref. they are Paras 4 - 7 this will simply act as a system of "checks and balances" to for manning levels, weapons and most importantly current game protection levels against the refs supplied.
http://www.military-today.com/apc/rosomak.htm

I got other important things to do before work (Late Post today, TG.) so I gotta go!!! Hope this helps, if any further assistance is needed let me know but, I'll need a day or two.

Regards,
Pat
:capt: