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Undead/Demon prophets
I think it was K who pointed out that undead Sauromatia priests can reanimate longdead horsemen, and other nations get special souless/longdead.
Who has capital D or 2S income and benefits from making a prophet out of a Black Servant or demon priest? Some nations also need an awake god with death in order to be able to cast Black Servant. The Prince of Death also gives free longdead, but it looks like they are always unit #194 (unarmored, broad sword). The list is: EA Arco: alchemy, D god, nothing special Marverni: alchemy, D god, nothing special Ulm: D god, nothing special TC: D god, nothing special Agartha: nothing special Fomoria: nothing special Helheim: nothing special Pan: Needs ND god for Carrion Centaur; gets three manikins instead of one CTis: lizard longdead with a few extra HP Kailasa: alchemy, D god, monkey longdead/soulless, great ghouls Lanka: monkey longdead with more HP Yomi: turn 2 Oni General prophet Ermor: nice longdead with tower shields Nief: gets nice longdead giants Sauromatia: reanimate longdead horsemen MA: Arco: alchemy, D god, nothing special Ermor: not needed Pythium: alchemy, D god, nothing special (but undead work well with Hydras) TC: alchemy, D god, nothing special Pan: Use Carrion Centaur; gets three manikins instead of one CTis: lizard longdead with a few extra HP Bandar: alchemy, D god, monkey longdead/soulless, great ghouls Ashdod: gets nice longdead Rephaites Shinuyama: nothing special LA: Arco: alchemy, D god, nothing special Ermor: not needed Ulm: D god, nothing special Marignon: alchemy, D god, TC: nothing special Agartha: nothing special Caelum: can make slightly better soulless CTis: not needed Pan: not needed Utgard: nice longdead giants Gath: alchemy, nothing special Atlantis: can make cool soulless Bogarus: alchemy, D god, nothing special "nothing special" just means the longdead raised by the prophet are regular longdead. They can still be useful if you need to fight a bunch of hydras or an Awe-Fear SC god. Of the 'nothing specials', here's my list of nations I really won't be doing this with: Bakemono: Weak priests, and weak starting army. Needs prophet who can preach and help expand. Also it's nice to make Kurofumi your prophet when he shows up, requiring that your current prophet do the honorable thing and jump in front of an elephant. So it's not worth the trouble of making an undead prophet to start. Fomoria, Helheim: Prophet will be too busy blessing to sit around raising undead. Pan: Not worth the trouble. |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Double check the versions of Atlantis. Some get undead with coral armor.
Neifleheim also gets giant longdead. Other giant nations may also. Caelum gets winged longdead. I think they are only size 3 and not really special. |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Sauromatia doesn't get longdead horsemen... they have 1h living priests. Anyone else could do the same by prophetizing a black servant or other undead summon. Not sure why you would single them out when anyone can do it.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Renojustin, Sauromatia is the only nation besides MA/LA Ermor whose H3 Undead or Demon priests get the 'reanimate longdead horsemen' command. I'm talking about summoning a Black Servant as soon as Conj-1 is researched, and making it my prophet.
K, thanks for the info. I tried Atlantis, and they do get their own special soulless. It's more troublesome to test the soulless than the longdead, of course. I'll give it a shot though. (PS I called Niefelheim 'Nief' because I'm lazy). I didn't check Atlantis except in LA because it's too troublesome for water nations to make a Black Servant. Edit: For the nations with easy access to undead prophets, I also saw these soulless: CTis get Soulless lizards. Nief/Jotun gets giant Soulless warriors Monkeys get soulless Bandar/Vanara/Markata LA Atlantis get souless with a Coral Cuirass LA Caelum get rotted-wing soulless that can't fly |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Fomoria doesn't get Longdead Giants? Poo.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Not according to my completely unscientific testing.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Well damn your nonscientific method. Jesus rode a dinosaur, wanna fight?!
How did you test btw? I'd put an hour into that myself, just to see. I really like Fomoria, they have that neat gianty-goodness, without that special Niefelheim feeling that you're exploiting the game completely. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
I just tested manually: create a game in each era, all human nations, Death on the pretender just in case. I used easyspell.dm to give all spells to avoid research hassles.
Hit 'End Turn' 5 times, then see who can summon a Black Servant (except Yomi and Lanka, they can make a Demon prophet on turn 2, though Lanka probably doesn't want to because its demons already have H). Summon the Black Servants, alchemise pearls if needed. End Turn. Tell the Black Servants to reanimate. End Turn 5 times, and look at what's in the provinces. For Soulless, I had to make the armies actually attack a neighbor, moving the prophet in and animating soulless. |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
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http://images.wikia.com/nonciclopedi...sus_raptor.jpg??? P.S. nice list vfb. Tnx for the time you spent doing those tests. I had seen the lizard and giant longdeads but I missed the Caelum ones and others... gonna give a look http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
That's wicked, K... I like it ^_^
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And Tifone, I love that picture, it's exactly what I was thinking of. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
R'lyeh definitely gets atlantian spearmen with coral spears and sometimes armor. I got them several times from carrion reanimation.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Lanka gets special ape ghouls called Pisacha. In fact I think they may be the only nation with special ghouls. It's worth noting as they are twice as good as the normal ones in my opinion.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
... and so do all ape nations.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Special ghouls!?!?! SWEET.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Yep, that is cool info! And they do look twice as good. I've updated the top post.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Well, I think this is true as far as you've tested it.
However, I think if you go to H4, via crystal shield, or either of the swords - that more nations give it. IIRC undead priests get +1 to their effective reanimate level. |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
No. Most of the nations don't get longdead horsemen at all. I'm currently playing Tien Chi with a H4 prophet.
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Crystal shield will not help you animate undead, of course. Swords will.
-Max |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
A crystal shield only works in battle. Only the two swords increase your H level outside battles.
Ano's right, only Sauromatia and MA/LA Ermor can reanimate horsemen. Sauromatia cannot reanimate lictors, even with an undead H4 or H5 priest. |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
As an aside, I've heard conjecture that Crystal Shield + Crystal Matrix makes Slave Matrix a cheap version of Ring of Wizardry through the Communion effect. I've never tried it, but it might come in handy if you're trying to cast high-path army buffs like Bone Grinding. You have enough slots on most casters for Skull Staff + Skullface + Ring of Sorcery + Crystal Matrix.
Edit: of course you could just equip the Crystal Shield directly. The advantage would be that you don't have to deal with the encumbrance, which actually makes it better for SCs than for casters now that I think of it. Chayot, for instance. -Max |
Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Reverse Communion Bonegrinding spam? Dear god.....
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